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Unleashed and Animal House, both released August of '06 are from Universal. See my post above.

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- My understanding was that it was something brand new, are the existing ones flippers?

In any event he's still full of BS.

He's trying to claim that HD-DVD buyers are complaining that their combi discs are 'forcing' SD DVD recordings on them "at $30".

(Even though they retail for the same money, if not slightly less, than any regular Blu-ray or HD-DVD disc.)

BS.

That's a lie.......and given the retail prices it doesn't even make any sense (people complaining about extra features or facilities they aren't paying any extra for, yeah right, I bet that happens all the time.
It's intelligence insulting - as all that viral marketing shilling is,
it's all such tedious & obvious BS)

The guys clearly a shill and a paid to shill at BB at that
(if that part is true).

There's no more to this than that.

Busted.

Think up a new handle and try again, that one just lost all credibility here, shill.

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My understanding was that it was something brand new, are the existing ones flippers?

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You understood wrong. The combo discs are nothing new like I listed in my post above. They are not "flippers" since you don't have to turn the disc over to watch the whole movie. The HD-DVD is on one side and the SD DVD is on the other - no turning over needed.

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He's trying to claim that HD-DVD buyers are complaining that their combi discs are 'forcing' SD DVD recordings on them "at $30".

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Here's a poll that shows that 2/3's of HD-DVD owners don't like combo discs:

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/poll.php?...lts&pollid=3706

More debate on avsforums about this combo issue:

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=773187

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=777893

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=772703

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=725062

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=760653

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=724737

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=730133

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=705917

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=716544

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=703041

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The HD-DVD is on one side and the SD DVD is on the other - no turning over needed.

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- Ah, as I thought, they are flippers.

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Here's a poll that shows that 2/3's of HD-DVD owners don't like combo discs

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- I don't know where you got 2/3rd from.

Most of the comment I saw was favourable and that which wasn't wanted no price premium.....which I showed was not the case earlier.

Features for no extra.

I simply don't believe claims that people are complaining about that.

It's obvious BS from the resident BS-artist and obvious shill.

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Ah, as I thought, they are flippers.

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Flipper means you have to turn them over to watch the whole movie.You don't need to for combo discs.

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I don't know where you got 2/3rd from.

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In this poll 66 percent or two thirds of respondents don't like the combo format. Didn't you open the link? If you read all the avsforum links you'll see that not everyone is embracing the combo format.

Thank you Error5 some people don't know the truth if it smack them in the face.

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Ah, as I thought, they are flippers.

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LOL...You are really misinformed this is what happen when you just read links & don't own any of the products.I'm still waiting on you to apologize.

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We/you were talking about the Universal discs

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Your putting words in my mouth i never said Universal disc i said combo disc.

Plus that double format disc has some HD-DVD owner's upset because HD-DVD is forceing you to buy there combo disc at 30.00 bucks.


I think its a damm good idea for HD-DVD to make the combo disc.Really this could curve the numbers in there favor because you will have it in HighDef when you ready to upgrade to HighDef and don't have to buy it again but like i said the price point not going to help that at all.I wish Blu-ray would do this.

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Your putting words in my mouth i never said Universal disc i said combo disc.

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- As usual you try to wriggle out of it.

You were responding to my comment with an attempt to spin some anti-HD-DVD line.

My original comment was "Especially when people realise they already have some of the movies in HD-DVD already on their Universal combi DVD discs"

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Plus that double format disc has some HD-DVD owner's upset because HD-DVD is forceing you to buy there combo disc at 30.00 bucks.

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- You're still trying to lie about the truth of this.

Talking of those links and the truth, you missed this comment -

"Are Combo discs more expensive than regular HD-DVD ??"

"Yes but only barely so as long as you don't purchase them from BB"

Perhaps that's why you can claim to have heard this complaint, it's about BB and not combi discs really.

Cos as I showed before, compared to regular HD-DVD or some Blu-ray releases there is no cost differential.

......and a 'flipper disc' here is not one that 'needs to be turned over to continue playing' anything.
It's merely a disc that gets turned over to it's other side for use.

You'll get no apology from me for calling you out on what you so clearly are BloobyBlu.

You're simply only ever here to talk up PS3 & Blu-ray any way you can and to diss HD-DVD as often as possible (although in your last comment you toned it down a bit on the combi discs cos even you must have twigged it's getting ridicuous).

You're a paid shill, spreading as much FUD as you can and soft-soaping any bad tales you can; plain and simple.

I wonder if you've deluded yourself that by talking up the PS3 & Blu-ray here you might sell a couple more and gain commission from the sales?

Nevermind the DRM, eh?

I never said anything about HD-DVD combo disc cost more than a Blu-ray that not even the topic we are talking about here.HD-DVD combo disc cost more than a basic HD-DVD disc by itself.That why people feel they are going to be forced to pay for both and not have a choice to which format they want because HD-DVD said that they was going to do all the movie's in the future as a combo disc.See i like Sony but went i feel they wrong i will bash them to no end.Your just a anti-Sony fan that looked for a reason to bash them,I give credit went credit due but you don't find me on here bashing stuff only the misleading info people provide to try to curve from the truth because one person has hate for a company.This whole HD-DVD vs Blu-ray war stuff is dumb people argue about two disc that are media that hold just about the same info the arguement should be about the content that is put onto that disc and the major company's that droping ton of money in to that format.

Originally posted by BobbyBlu:

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I never said anything about HD-DVD combo disc cost more than a Blu-ray that not even the topic we are talking about here.HD-DVD combo disc cost more than a basic HD-DVD disc by itself.

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- We've already seen that is not true, shill.

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See i like Sony

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- You don't say.

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Your just a anti-Sony fan

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- Get over yourself.

I am not 'pro' or 'anti' any corporation.

I am anti CE systems that rob their owners of actual ownership.

Which is what Blu-ray is and what it does.

PS3 is intended to make that happen, it is part of the same idiotic philosophy.

You can keep your insane and desperately sad notions of 'love' or 'hate' for a foreign multinational corporation to yourself.

Back to topic....

This announcement from the HD DVD Promotion Group won't help swing the momentum over to their side:

No Jaws, Jurassic Park and ET on HD DVD

http://www.hddvdprg.com/eng/list.html

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The inclusion in the January 29 update of our "Coming Soon List" of three Steven Spielberg classics was an error on our part. The HD DVD Promotion Group expresses sincere apologies to Steven Spielberg, Universal Studios Home Entertainment and HD DVD fans for this mistake.

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Universal management is going through a shake-up. The chief officer is being replaced.

http://www.latimes.com/news/local/la-me-...l=la-home-local

It is the president of Universal Home Entertainment, a division of Universal Pictures, that is taking the hard line of being HD-DVD exclusive. But he is only the president and has to report to the new chief officer. It looks more and more likely that Universal will go at least dual format, maybe this year. As it is, Warner now has said they will be re-releasing titles in Blu-ray that were exclusively HD-DVD last year. Blu-ray has several studios that are Blu-ray exclusive and with Paramount, Warner and New Line releasing titles in both formats, it is Blu-ray that has about a 90% choice of all titles with only about the 10% HD-DVD exclusive titles not available. Most of these are Universal. But Universal is now only releasing mostly old movies and the new releases are slowing down, while the Blu-ray titles are really starting to grow and should start sky-rocketing by this summer with some huge Blu-ray only titles. Just look at http://www.thedvdwars.com and the graphs have crossed over, almost all Blu-ray as far as sales rankings. The only line where HD-DVD is ahead of Blu-ray is titles in stock but that seems to indicate Amazon is not able to keep as much Blu-ray in stock as HD-DVD. It has been a dramatic turning of the tables over just a few weeks. Imagine what it will be like in a few months.

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Yawn, what a crock - and it's such ancient spin.

The Blu-ray Bobs have been flogging that one since before CES.

Then Universal went and announced 100 new HD-DVD titles and not a single glimmer of Blu-ray support.

I've been an HD DVD consumer since practically day 1 with my HD-A1 player. I must say that the recent performance of the HD-DVD group with respect to new releases and poor sales has me disappointed. They knew they had the momentum coming into the holiday season and it seems that they just gave up. I know they have promised more releases this year but it could be too little too late considering the BluRay juggernaut that's coming. Now I've covered my bases with a PS3 since some movies I want to see are not coming out on HD DVD.

Talking of combos - Universal says that 90% of their releases will be combo discs:

http://dvd.themanroom.com/dvd-newsview.php?id=447

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Universal has issued a press release affirming their support for Toshiba's high definition format pledging more than 100 new film and TV titles will be available throughout this year. Additionally, over 90% of the upcoming titles will be released as Combo Format DVD/HD DVD discs, no doubt a move to lure DVD buyers into taking the high-def plunge.

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I've been an HD DVD consumer since practically day 1 with my HD-A1 player. I must say that the recent performance of the HD-DVD group with respect to new releases and poor sales has me disappointed. They knew they had the momentum coming into the holiday season and it seems that they just gave up. I know they have promised more releases this year but it could be too little too late considering the BluRay juggernaut that's coming. Now I've covered my bases with a PS3 since some movies I want to see are not coming out on HD DVD.

Talking of combos - Universal says that 90% of their releases will be combo discs:

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I remember back when you told everyone that you had just got a HD-DVD player it was you & dblbogey7.Whenever diabolos,dblbogey7,& you speak i listen because you guys are well informed and not going to shoot people BS on this site nor will you mislead people on here.

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it maybe true that there are not not many Blu-ray readers/burners being bought now, but, when they become more readily available, the price will drop. also, Blu-ray does have the advantage of holding more data than HD-DVD. because of the capacity gap, i think more people will buy Blu-ray discs.

also, computer manufacturers are probably betting on this, hence why they are choosing Blu-ray. for me, personally, I don't care about watching a movie in high def. at that resolution, graphic artifacts start to be noticeable. and I don't mind watching a regular dvd on my tv. it looks good enough for me.

the only thing i care about is being able to burn more data onto a disk. just as a fyi, I have 150 dvds full of videos that I can only watch on my computer. and high def on my computer won't impress anyone :D

Thank you guys so much for drowning HughJars in logic. He shot his mouth off so much (made me want to plug my ears) calling people liars when he himself was one. Sorry guy you have now been slapped with the ignorant fanboy bat. No matter what happens you will follow HD-DVD even if they stopped selling them you would continue to say its going to win. I just wanted to congratulate the winners of the conversation, all those in opposition to HughJars.

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the price will drop. also, Blu-ray does have the advantage of holding more data than HD-DVD. because of the capacity gap, i think more people will buy Blu-ray discs.

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- Well as with all Blu-ray stuff it starts from so much higher a price that it's never going to match HD-DVD any time soon.
The Blu-ray camp talk about lower prices in 3 years.

You're also wrong about capacity.

The current tech is for 50gb Blu-ray and 51gb HD-DVD, so it's HD-DVD that actually has the lead.
Rumours of 100gb and 200gb discs coming to the market at some point in the future remain just that.
There is also no proof the current players and burners will work with those discs.

Like I said, there are currently 4 different Blu-ray specs. They hope to finalise and freeze on a final spec at the end of this year.

You'll just have to hope you haven't bought a 1st or 2nd gen machine that won't be left behind.

Ludikhris, hilarious, as always. :P

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You'll just have to hope you haven't bought a 1st or 2nd gen machine that won't be left behind.

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The same goes for HD-DVD as current players can't play the 51 GB discs. It's not part of current HD DVD specs.

[quoteThe same goes for HD-DVD as current players can't play the 51 GB discs. It's not part of current HD DVD specs.[/quote] - Actually you are completely wrong.

Triple layer was part of the original spec of both Blu-ray and HD-DVD.

(which is something for those looking forward to the 4 or more layered 100gb-200gb Blu-ray discs, they most defintely are not part of the original spec.

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Toshiba Unsure Whether 51 GB HD DVD Works in Existing Players
By Scott M. Fulton, III, BetaNews
January 17, 2007, 11:54 AM

A spokesperson for Toshiba of America told BetaNews late yesterday that the company is still researching whether a new, three-layer HD DVD disc format it may propose -- the existence of which was carefully leaked at last week's CES -- will work in the first generation on HD DVD players, including its own.

"Since the disc is not standardized yet," the spokesperson told BetaNews, "we are researching whether it is applicable to the current HD DVD players."

Toshiba representatives apparently handed out press releases to a few journalists last week who probably noticed a "51 GB" label on some of its display discs, and asked what it meant. Independent journalist Henning Molbaek of DVDTown.com was one of them, publishing as soon as January 9 what many sources were only learning a whole week later.

The capability for HD DVD -- as well as Blu-ray -- to implement three layers on one side has been written into the specifications since the format's inception.

But the fact that each layer is limited to 17 GB, rather than the 25 GB per layer that's possible with dual-layer blue-laser discs, may be an indication that a three-layer format such as the one Warner Bros. patented last year may not have been feasible with older or existing blue-laser players after all.

As it turned out, the company introduced a double-decker sandwich format at CES instead, under the Total HD trademark.

It's unclear whether Warner will pursue its three-layer, single-sided combo format, though the likelihood now is fairly low.

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http://www.betanews.com/article/Toshiba_...yers/1169052893

Actually I'm correct. The specs are straight from the from the DVD forum white paper on HD-DVD:

http://www.dvdforum.org/images/Forum_HD_DVD_Universal_24.pdf

There is no mention of triple layer 51 gig discs. This is why current players can't play 51 gig discs.

Originally posted by error5:

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Actually I'm correct. The specs are straight from the from the DVD forum white paper on HD-DVD: (see link)

There is no mention of triple layer 51 gig discs. This is why current players can't play 51 gig discs.

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You're now reduced to quibbling.

First of all that link is not the complete technical spec and secondly triple layers were part of the original spec.

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The capability for HD DVD -- as well as Blu-ray -- to implement three layers on one side has been written into the specifications since the format's inception.

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http://www.betanews.com/article/Toshiba_...yers/1169052893

Originally it was a 45gb triple layer disc.

They are now working on ensuring that the 51gb triple layer disc will work just as easily, that is all.

But interesting attempt to divert attention from anyone telling the truth about all the fantasy & cr@p talked about 'the 100gb & 200gb discs and their supposed amazing untility' to existing Blu-ray hardware & owners.

Actually error5 is correct. A 51 Gig triple layer disc is "off spec." Current HD DVD's are 15 Gig per layer so in order to fit 51 Gigs in 3 layers each layer should have 17 gigs. Will the discs be physically different from the ones they have now? If so then current drives will probably need to be replaced to handle the new physical characteristics of the discs. A firmware update probably wouldn't do and current owners of first and second gen players (like myself) would need to upgrade.

I stand corrected. If HD-DVD can support up to 51gigs, then I would support that in a snap. The larger the capacity, the happier I'll be.

however, if the Blu-ray spec does allow for triple (or even quadruple) layers, well, then looks like Blu-ray is the best. anyword on the price of a triple layer HD-DVD burner? shoot, for that matter, has anyone been able to find a dual layer Blu-ray burner?

also, (probably my dumbness here) where did you see that HD-DVD capacity will get to 100gig or even 200gig? I tried a google search, and, well, found nothing :-(

Ludikhris
because of hughhjars, I've learned a lot, so,I don't mind his remarks. he IS right about Blu-ray...the specs haven't been finalized yet, so if I were to go buy a new Blu-ray burner...well i'd f-ed when the specs change.

Just to add to this triple layer discussion:

TL45 for HD DVD has not been approved as a spec by the DVD Forum (which has the final say in these things.) Although it has been replicator verified since 2005 there has just been no need for it. Also current players are known to be able to support it from what I've read. Current use of the VC-1 codec has made the DL30 discs more than adequate for practically all releases. Even King Kong which runs for more than 3 hours fits in a DL30 with no compromise in video quality. Toshiba was supposed to submit this spec for approval this year but...

TL51 comes along and of course they had to table TL45. I've also read that Toshiba was supposed to submit this spec for approval later this year so neither TL spec is in the official HD DVD spec list since neither has been approved by the DVD Forum.

The other issue is that TL51 is supposed to be 1.5x speed so the electronics current players may not be able to cope with the increased data rate.

Bottom line is - triple layer discs for both HD DVD and BluRay are mostly vaporware for now.

Originally posted by kearney:

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however, if the Blu-ray spec does allow for triple (or even quadruple) layers, well, then looks like Blu-ray is the best.

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- Well as I keep saying a theoretical capacity is one thing, an affordable reliable product in the market-place is quite another.

They are currently subsidising Blu-ray media heavily
(check out the Vivid comments about Blu-ray discs being 3 to 4 times the cost of authoring and producing compared to HD-DVD).

It took them ages to even get dual layer Blu-ray working, God knows how much the media would really cost without the subsidy ....it's not exactly 'cheap' now.
(all those Blu-ray fanboys really ought to thank HD-DVD, without it you'd have had nothing but cr@ppy MPEG2 releases on 25gb discs at God only knows what price)


I suspect 100gb & 200gb discs will never be anything more than extremely expensive low-volume production 'professional use only' archiving media only usable with accompanying low-volume production and extremely expensive 'professional use only' hardware.

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anyword on the price of a triple layer HD-DVD burner? shoot, for that matter, has anyone been able to find a dual layer Blu-ray burner?

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- HD-DVD burners have been in laptops for a little while (its how come you can find blank media now).

The Toshiba launches it's first PC burner in march IIRC, others are expected to follow (NEC has been demo'ing one for over 2yrs).
We await the final specs.

It's perfectly possible TL is never used for retail movie media (because the VC-1 codec is so good and the additional space is never needed) but is confined to an option for PC burners (which will, I hope, operate with stand-alones).

TL HD-DVD is ready to go when they need it, the thing is that as far as retail movie discs go they simply don't see the need right now, they are fitting excellent SQ & PQ on 30gbs.

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where did you see that HD-DVD capacity will get to 100gig or even 200gig? I tried a google search, and, well, found nothing

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- Did I mistype?
If so apologies, it should have read Blu-ray.
It has supposedly been a great benefit for Blu-ray that there is a theoretical possibility of getting 100gb & 200gb discs.

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because of hughhjars, I've learned a lot, so,I don't mind his remarks. he IS right about Blu-ray...the specs haven't been finalized yet, so if I were to go buy a new Blu-ray burner...well i'd f-ed when the specs change.

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- Thank you.

It's nice to see someone doesn't prefer to write everything I've posted as mere opinion.

Sadly it has long been the case (even here) that if you refuse to back one side in this debate or challenge the stream of FUD and wildly exaggerated claims
(which, let's be honest, is invariably coming from one side alone in this)
and you stick to telling the factual truth about what's really happening you just get abused for 'loving' and 'hating' one side or other.

(which IMO is a pathetic, totally weird, surreal and frankly ill concept when applied to multi-national CE corporations)

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Thank you guys so much for drowning HughJars in logic. He shot his mouth off so much (made me want to plug my ears) calling people liars when he himself was one

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Just bring truth to the misinformed.

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Sorry to puncture some people's delusions but here is the truth (like I said, 2 bald men and that comb) -
realise that sales of both Blu-ray & HD-DVD combined are but a fraction of UMD-Video - a failed format.

The resident shill talking about 'truth' and people being 'Misinformed' unbe-F**king-lievable.