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Napster shifts blame elsewhere for poor success

Written by James Delahunty (Google+) @ 02 Mar 2006 7:47 User comments (43)

Napster shifts blame elsewhere for poor success Napster has put the blame on Microsoft and other manufacturers for the company's failure to provide real competition for Apple's iTunes music store. The company which made a complete transformation from the P2P service near everyone knows about from years back, has blamed glitches in Microsoft's Windows Media Digital Rights Management (DRM) software for its poor performance. "There is no question that their execution has been less than brilliant over the last 12 months," Napster chairman and chief executive Chris Gorog said at a New York conference.
"Our business does rely on Microsoft's digital rights management software and our business model also relies on Microsoft's ecosystem of device manufacturers," he added. He claims that the company has a tougher job than Apple to provide a successful service. "It's a lot more complex to get organised properly than it is to build one device and one service as Apple has done," he said. "It's always been painful at the introduction of new technologies. But it always takes shape like it's done in the past."

He is confident however that success will come in the future as companies will be increasingly using Microsoft's Windows Media software. "Ultimately, the consumer electronics giants ... are all going to come to this Windows Media party," he said. "This is really going to be the ubiquitous format." One way Napster and other companies expected to bring down Apple was to provide music subscription services. However, it just appears that most consumers are just confused about the idea of "renting music".

Source:
Australian IT

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43 user comments

12.3.2006 11:40

The reason Apple has done so well with their products and their iTunes service is because of advertisement. Correct me if I'm wrong here, but has any one of you ever seen a napster advert on the TV? I'm sure you have seen an iTunes advertisement on the TV, the trick to it all is advertisement. I must say I absolutely hate all apple products, there are so many better alternatives that offer better service and better quality products with better value for money, but the trick to good sales these days is advertisement. -Mike

22.3.2006 14:49

Dosent Itunes use DRM? if not thats a plus,I wouldnt dout the RIAA draining them dry either look at the hell they put radio over the net/net radio thru ><

32.3.2006 16:48

iTunes uses a DRM, but not the same one as Windows Media. The complaint Napster is lodging is that Microsoft has done a poor job of properly developing a DRM that consumers won't mind as much as the one in effect now. I know the iTunes DRM is easily gotten around by putting the files on an audio disc, I'm not sure if it's quite as simple with the Windows Media DRM. I'd be interested to hear if anyone knows :) Napster is also complaining that Microsoft hasn't made enough effort to make a portable music player that can compete with the iPod in functionality and become a status icon. Apple has done a wonderful job in marketing, and ties all of its products together leading to quite a bit of success. I'm not an Apple fanboy or anything, but I certaintly think they are doing a job well done.

42.3.2006 17:07

[quout] Mik3h (Senior Member) 2 March 2006 16:40 The reason Apple has done so well with their products and their iTunes service is because of advertisement. Correct me if I'm wrong here, but has any one of you ever seen a napster advert on the TV?


Yes, I have. It was during last years Superbowl. The commerical was some guy holding a sign saying 1,000,000 iTunes songs = $1,000,000... Unlimited songs @ Napster only $14.99 per month. It really made the light go on in my head. Sadly however, it was the only time I have seen it. Great commerical though.

52.3.2006 17:28

Advertisement is one good reason, but for me it's just that AAC beats the crap out of MP3. That's just my opinion based solely on personal experience. I am not an audio professional so I can't back it up with solid data. To my ears, AAC sounds great for a lossy format...

63.3.2006 10:01

DarkJello, Yes. With Napster, you can also get-around the DRM by making a CD. I signed-up for Napster Light, purchased about a dozen songs, and immediately "archived" them to audio CD. (I don't own a portable player.) hermes_vb , Actually Napster uses WMA, not MP3. Too bad it's not the lossless WMA format... I wouldn't mind the longer download time for a perfect copy.

73.3.2006 10:14

I stand corrected DVDDoug. Still, I personally put MP3 and WMA on the same level of quality. That's just me.

83.3.2006 10:55

14.99$ for unlimited songs seems very reasonable, unlike itunes which I think is too expensive for my liking.

93.3.2006 11:07

When they start doign aniem and game songs and I can find the obscure ones then I'll be happy to sign up untill then theres not enough US songs I can stand that would make it worth getting

103.3.2006 11:22

"14.99$ for unlimited songs" If you quit paying the monthy fee the songs stop working. Deee Arrrr Emmmmm I suppose if Napster allows you to burn audio CDs a person could convert those to MP3 (with some inevitable loss of quality), but that would be illegal...

113.3.2006 11:25

GrayArea 0_o why do I ahve a feelign that "Napster" is hell on dail up much like Vaules STEAM is 0-o you not online..then you cant paly HA ah AH ah AHAHAHA 0-o

123.3.2006 14:19

I used Napsters service for a while but dropped them for Yahoo Unlimited for two reasons. Yahoo is only half the price, and the songs are 192kbps as compared to Napsters 128kbps. I personally prefer the renting music because after I listen to a song for a few months I no longer care to hear it again. Using Yahoo unlimited I can hear and play all the new songs that come out for less than $7 dollars a month and put them all on my Zen player. I've saved megabucks from this service because I used to buy all the music I listen to spending and average of $50 a month.

133.3.2006 15:21

mm2000y Ever feel like puting soem fo the music on tape? *L*

143.3.2006 15:34

Zippy, are you drunk?

153.3.2006 16:00

DVDBack23 No I am strange :P you never have vocies that pop up in you head that give 5-20 sec ad like sayings? Picture thing HL 2 playing,then to goes to the guy paly it then it switchs to another guy getting ready to paly it and then a old bald asain martail arts instrutor pops up hits him on the back with a twig and says in a badly dubed way " You not online you no paly HA hahaha HA ha ha" I hate my mind >>

163.3.2006 16:18
xhardc0re
Inactive

Any company in bed w/Microsoft & their evil DRM *deserves* to go down.

173.3.2006 16:41

Quote:
DVDBack23 No I am strange :P you never have vocies that pop up in you head that give 5-20 sec ad like sayings?
LMAO, you do know they have meds for that now right? ;)

183.3.2006 18:05

If every music lover new how to use the program "Tunebite", the renting music services such as Napster and Yahoo Unlimited would be the only music services available. The rest of them, including iTunes would go out of business. Making tapes or CDs - no problem.

193.3.2006 20:15

DVDBack23 but but they make me a cranky drunk..at elast now I hear all kinda of thigns but wouldnt hurt a fly..might cry at its death..wait would that make me a emo drunk? LOL dont you love natrualy drunk pll 0-o

203.3.2006 20:32

"The commerical was some guy holding a sign saying 1,000,000 iTunes songs = $1,000,000... Unlimited songs @ Napster only $14.99 per month." I remember that but that was the Only commerial I have every seen of Napster. I wonder if the money would have been better spent spreading out the commercial on a other channels. For example why not market to the idiots that watch MTV they lap anything up. Also Napster is there image. They sold out in the mind of a lot of people.

214.3.2006 17:41

"The commerical was some guy holding a sign saying 1,000,000 iTunes songs = $1,000,000... Unlimited songs @ Napster only $14.99 per month." I prefer: Unlimited songs for $0 At least iTunes makes it easy to add my free music to our digital library, and my wife's iPod. Until the industry stops being a fanbase-suing, artist-abusing machine, my dollars will not support it. I think it's laughable, what a dismal failure their counterfeit Napster is.

225.3.2006 1:32

Clearmoon "counterfeit Napster" Are you talk about the new Napster thats totaly BS or Itunes thats alil less BS? LOL

235.3.2006 8:10
riplord
Inactive

Zippy has a point about the tape thing...they won't ever be able to plug the "analog hole".

245.3.2006 15:46

Personally I think both are equally BS

255.3.2006 16:06

riplord pll used to record off the radio and do mix tapes now they do it to CDs and the media industy is in a fit becuse cds are so easy to make they dont have thier monoploy anymore,sicne they didnt refouce thier efforts on makeing a easy to use pay for download shceems its thier loss for not getting on the ball now they are but they stilla re trying to make a monoply out of it and wind up creating thigns like napster and Itunes..they waste way to much money on trying to keep pll from copying the stuff they bought hell I could join Itunes and put every song on CD Taped it then CD it,their wasteing time and money trying to make soemthign that is normal now adays bad or wrong. they have the means for a win win sultoin but they would rather make it where thier the only winners....


Copyright infringement is nothing more than civil disobedience to a bad set of laws. Lets renegotiate them.

---
Check out my crappy creations
http://zippydsmlee.deviantart.com/

265.3.2006 22:44
riplord
Inactive

I see your logic. But the point I was trying to get at is at the very least you can defeat DRM by using a tape recorder to a speaker or some similar method. Which to me, this is my opinion(I could be wrong) , totally makes DRM worthless.



275.3.2006 22:58

Quote:
ZIppyDSM (Member) 5 March 2006 21:06 riplord pll used to record off the radio and do mix tapes now they do it to CDs and the media industy is in a fit becuse cds are so easy to make they dont have thier monoploy anymore,sicne they didnt refouce thier efforts on makeing a easy to use pay for download shceems its thier loss for not getting on the ball now they are but they stilla re trying to make a monoply out of it and wind up creating thigns like napster and Itunes..they waste way to much money on trying to keep pll from copying the stuff they bought hell I could join Itunes and put every song on CD Taped it then CD it,their wasteing time and money trying to make soemthign that is normal now adays bad or wrong. they have the means for a win win sultoin but they would rather make it where thier the only winners....
Why would make a tape copy? This is all I could take/understand out of your post. Your post is almost like posting in all caps.

286.3.2006 4:26

I think the problem for Napster is the monthly fee. Most people don't like commitment. THey look at it and it's like "15/month, that's 180/year, that's too much!"... instead if you tell em it's $1/song, it's like you don't know how much you are going to spend each month or each year. I mean, you could buy a whole record in iTunes for 14.99 and that's it, it's one month of unlimited download in napster, but most people don't look at it that way.

296.3.2006 6:01

rosedog to beat any digital rights managment on media from day 1 go DMR meida to analog tape to Unvirsal Digital media is bascily what I ment..... *rereads post mmmmm my last post only has 3 or 5 error..comapred to the rest its a master peice....anyway soemtiems I wodner if pll have forgotten to read...but then...I still learnign to write ><*

306.3.2006 8:02

Reading zippy's post takes a lot of time and courage hehehehe No seriously Zip, how do we read your posts!!

318.3.2006 7:28

Quote from mm2000y: "If every music lover new how to use the program "Tunebite", the renting music services such as Napster and Yahoo Unlimited would be the only music services available. The rest of them, including iTunes would go out of business. Making tapes or CDs - no problem." This program IS awesome. Costs only $17 or so, and legally high-speed records the songs that are liscensed to your computer, through your sound card. I will do ogg, mp3 with LAME dll, or WMA/WMA Lossless. Rather convenient.

328.3.2006 7:34

hot_ice UUUUmmmmmm....aannnoooo..... Lets see take day one uncrackable media and hook your VCR up to it tape it then record it on the computer DRM media > tape/analog > normal easy to convert media I am think they will have no more success at DRM than game companies have with CD/DVD protection...its a loss for everyone

338.3.2006 7:37

Hot_ice damn forgot to add to that last post since I am learning japanese little by little I am adding japanese words to my incoherence :3

349.3.2006 6:31

The people that make Tunebite also have a proggy that makes recordings of songs from internet radio stations. Set it for what type of music you like, let it run overnight, & in the morning you have a thousand or more songs to sift through with no copy protection, & all (currently) 100% LEGAL!!!

359.3.2006 19:37

This action by the French will be about as effective as the Maginot Line was in World War II. Folks will just go around it, as did the Germans. Phil

3610.3.2006 18:14

Isepiq(nebie) There is a program is called 3aLabiRadio works great. You can add music stations that you would like to hear, and you can sort through the songs and choose when to listen as well.

3712.3.2006 17:37

Quote:
One way Napster and other companies expected to bring down Apple was to provide music subscription services. However, it just appears that most consumers are just confused about the idea of "renting music".
I disagree. It appears to me that it is Napster who was confused from the start. They thought that if they kept the old name (Napster) that no one would notice that by their business model that they are actually the Anti-Napster. A transcript of their first Board meeting must read something like "Those dumb consumers, most of them are kids, anyhow, they think that Napster is cool. They will never even notice that the new Napster stands against everything that the old Napster stood for." It also appears that the current Napster is confused on the differences in price between renting a product and selling the same product. Don't expect to get flooded with orders when you are trying to steamroll the consumers with such a blatantly one-sided business model. This business concept is disadvantageous to the consumer. Napster should not be so shocked that the consumer isn't enthusiastically embracing the music subscription model. There's just too many other entertainment options available to allow one's self to be led down that rocky road. People understand that music was not originally created to be owned by a fortunate few who wish to exploit the creation to become filthy rich by "whoring it out" to the mass public. I don't mind paying a reasonable price to purchase a song as there are costs involved in procuring music. I will not, however, pay full face value just for the privilege of listening on a pay per listen basis. Next they will try to charge us by the note for each song we hear. The public has seen and will continue to see through Yapster's greedy facade.

3813.3.2006 18:30

It kinda sucks, but the fact that music is still being exploited as it is, is due to the amount of advertising used to get the music out there. The very thing that allows people to know about this is the very thing that's making it so high in price. This whole idea of renting is stupid within itself. Why not just sample the music first, see if you like it, then pay a little more for it, and sell it back when you don't want it anymore? It does sound weird, but I heard that they are starting to do that with CDs, so why not used MP3s? And trust me, if something as stupid as my solution would appease the conglomerates, then they seriously need some help in the head.


If Im online, Im usually on Steam:
http://steamcommunity.com/id/Rikorage

3913.3.2006 23:50

That's not so wierd Rikoshay - (BTW, nice looking signature). Amazon.com and e-bay do pretty well turning over previously owned merchandise. Unfortunately, this issue seems to fall into the broad category of the rich and connected taking care of their own. I know, that's just the way things work in this world and if I don't like it I can contribute megabucks to the election campaigns of certain strategic lawmakers. (That is, I could were I not so "wealth-challenged".) I'm sure if you were able to ask any RIAA spokesperson why they think they are entitled to dictate where, when and how we listen to our purchased music, if we agree not to distribute extra copies of purchased songs, they would tell you that some unscrupulous people do distribute the music for profit. Of course these people are in violation and should be open for prosecution if convicted. The thing is, the RIAA, through DRM and failure to acknowledge fair use policies, is allowed their preference of treating all consumers as if they are thieves because a small percentage of us actually are. That's sort of like if the Highway Patrol decided that it was too much work to actually go out and stop vehicles that are violating the speed limit, so instead they just sent out citations through the mail to all registered motorists in their particular state or territory.

4016.3.2006 10:34
vudoo
Inactive

First of all if you kids don’t stop saying you’ll never pay for music, you can expect severe copy protection in the future. With that being said I sue both p2p and legal services such as iMesh and mp3search.ru. I go for the rare stuff like Jeff Lynne and ELO as well as groups like Smile and Metal bands like Dokken. I’ve been able to Download full albums 100 albums for just $50. That is less than $1/Album. I don’t see why you kids keep crying when there are plenty of Russian services that have great music and for far less than iTunes. And if you would have joined iMesh during its Beta testing you’d be subscribing to it for just $7/Mo. And with Tunebite you could all your little hearts desire of music. I know the RIAA sucks, but at the same time you have to be realistic.

4120.3.2006 14:04

You're right vudoo. Even though the RIAA does suck, people are still going to be annoyed by it. If I can find an album I've been looking for or find interesting, I'll buy it, but, if I'm short on cash, too lazy to go look, or just want to hear it to see if it's good, I'll just head to Frostwire. But, the main topic here is the article, and it's to discuss why Napster is doing badly. What you pointed out, vudoo, and what a lot of other people pointed out, is that they aren't giving much for the prices they ask for. If they were more fair about it, or at least given more options, then they wouldn't have anything to worry about. Blaming it on the merger with Whoever doesn't change the fact that they aren't trying anymore. That's what happened with WinAmp. You kick out the original creator, get a bunch of losers who couldn't even program in Java, and you get a pile of you-know-what. @freshguy: Thanks for the compliment! Phantom69 did a great job. Also I want to thank all the people who supplied the userbars as well, even though I don't know who they are.


If Im online, Im usually on Steam:
http://steamcommunity.com/id/Rikorage

4216.4.2006 0:18

Quote:
The reason Apple has done so well with their products and their iTunes service is because of advertisement. Correct me if I'm wrong here, but has any one of you ever seen a napster advert on the TV? I'm sure you have seen an iTunes advertisement on the TV, the trick to it all is advertisement. I must say I absolutely hate all apple products, there are so many better alternatives that offer better service and better quality products with better value for money, but the trick to good sales these days is advertisement. -Mike
I honestly don't ever recall seeing a iTunes chimaerical. I do however remember seeing several napster commercials when they first went paid.

437.7.2006 6:33

It is truly beyond me why the record companies can be so incredibly blind. If they really want people to stop ripping their music off the net, why don't they just set up their own unique MP3 download site. Give previewable songs, individual song purchases with discounts for the purchase of the entire album, free streaming songs on the site etc. This would open an entirely new door to the record labels giving them the option to avoid mass media advertisement through television and print resources and give them the broadest customer base in the world... THE INTERNET USERS! I am seriously considering writing a letter to EMI, Capital, Sony Music and so on to let them know of their grave miscalculation on the profitability of this business plan. The amount of money that could be saved from the exeunt of mass advertising and costs to shippers and distributors (HMV, Sunrise, Sam the Record Man) would be enough, in my opinion to allow the record label to sell their albums online for a very minimal fee, possibly saving up to 50% of the accrued cost of a final CD purchased from a retail branch. Get off your horses (Napster, ITunes etc.) slap them on the ass and tell them you want them to fuck right off. Take any advantageous position you can in life and business, so why bother with the possibility of further lawsuits, shutdowns and controversy... LET THE RECORD COMPANIES DEVELOP THEIR OWN MP3 p2p PROGRAMS!!! just think about that...

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