AfterDawn: Tech news

MPAA want to make movie camming a criminal offense in UK

Written by Andre Yoskowitz (Google+) @ 07 Sep 2007 8:31 User comments (35)

MPAA want to make movie camming a criminal offense in UK After success in Canada, Italy, Japan and even somewhat in the US, the MPAA is continuing its world tour and moving on to the UK where it will try to convince legislators to criminalize the camming of movies while they are in theaters.
The main aim of the tour is to make camming a more serious offense than it currently is (misdemeanor/civil offense) and pave the way for stronger punishments that will keep the offender in jail for years instead of days or months.

MPAA head Dan Glickman is in the UK talking to UK film minister Margaret Hodge and representatives from the UK Film Council in which he hopes to persuade them to make the laws more severe.

Although, most regulars of Afterdawn know that the MPAA time after time makes up figures, and has even compared pirates to terrorists, their tour has been successful so far, with legislations going through around the world making cammers into criminals.

Source:
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35 user comments

17.9.2007 8:57

Maybe we should make it the death penalty for those severe criminals cam'n the theater movies since they are a real plight on society. LOL

I think a day in jail is too much if their push wasn’t real hitting this would be just funny but it just doesn't stop and shows us how corrupt our systems really are.

27.9.2007 9:18

Originally posted by Mr-Movies:
Maybe we should make it the death penalty for those severe criminals cam'n the theater movies since they are a real plight on society. LOL

I think a day in jail is too much if their push wasn’t real hitting this would be just funny but it just doesn't stop and shows us how corrupt our systems really are.

So you're saying it should be perfectly legal for someone to steal what doesn't belong to them?

37.9.2007 9:57

They will have their work cut out over here (UK) Our jails are so full we cant even jail Rapists, Murderers and drug dealers. I'm sure Mr Brown has got more on his mind than how much USA movie stars and companys are suffering.

47.9.2007 10:31

Quote:
Originally posted by Mr-Movies:
Maybe we should make it the death penalty for those severe criminals cam'n the theater movies since they are a real plight on society. LOL

I think a day in jail is too much if their push wasn’t real hitting this would be just funny but it just doesn't stop and shows us how corrupt our systems really are.

So you're saying it should be perfectly legal for someone to steal what doesn't belong to them?
the problem is that camming a movie is not the same as breaking into the cinematographer's booth and stealing the reel of film. If someone did that, then there would be no question of theft. No matter how you look at it, copying just isn't the same as stealing. The word "Stealing" conjures up the image that the previous owner no longer has access to the object. That is simply not true in this case, and that is probably why so many people don't feel bad about making a copy. It doesn't deprive anyone else from enjoying the object.

57.9.2007 10:54

Quote:
Quote:
Originally posted by Mr-Movies:
Maybe we should make it the death penalty for those severe criminals cam'n the theater movies since they are a real plight on society. LOL

I think a day in jail is too much if their push wasn’t real hitting this would be just funny but it just doesn't stop and shows us how corrupt our systems really are.

So you're saying it should be perfectly legal for someone to steal what doesn't belong to them?
the problem is that camming a movie is not the same as breaking into the cinematographer's booth and stealing the reel of film. If someone did that, then there would be no question of theft. No matter how you look at it, copying just isn't the same as stealing. The word "Stealing" conjures up the image that the previous owner no longer has access to the object. That is simply not true in this case, and that is probably why so many people don't feel bad about making a copy. It doesn't deprive anyone else from enjoying the object.
Spin the words as you want... stealing is stealing. I can't understand why so many people go to such lengths just to try and justify it.

67.9.2007 11:39

Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
Originally posted by Mr-Movies:
Maybe we should make it the death penalty for those severe criminals cam'n the theater movies since they are a real plight on society. LOL

I think a day in jail is too much if their push wasn’t real hitting this would be just funny but it just doesn't stop and shows us how corrupt our systems really are.

So you're saying it should be perfectly legal for someone to steal what doesn't belong to them?
the problem is that camming a movie is not the same as breaking into the cinematographer's booth and stealing the reel of film. If someone did that, then there would be no question of theft. No matter how you look at it, copying just isn't the same as stealing. The word "Stealing" conjures up the image that the previous owner no longer has access to the object. That is simply not true in this case, and that is probably why so many people don't feel bad about making a copy. It doesn't deprive anyone else from enjoying the object.
Spin the words as you want... stealing is stealing. I can't understand why so many people go to such lengths just to try and justify it.
Says that from the man that has a tricked out 360,I am sorry you are breaking the media mafias law by playing back ups even if you own them or not :P

When it comes down to it its a crime,but its not worse than public drunkenness or fist fighting in public or any other "minor" crime that can net you a small fine and a vocal flogging from a judge.

Keep it simple people 5$USD for every minute captured or whatever the judge thinks is appropriate under the maxim(can not go over 5X 155 minutes) should be a reasonable charge,ya it sucks to cam in crappy quality a 600$ 2 hour movie but all in all the punishment fits the crime.

Or go with a 250 flat rate fine.

This crime is no worse than speeding, parking tickets and other lil things you get in trouble for, to send people to jail or comiunty service or 1000+ fines is foolish and shows how corrupted society has become..

77.9.2007 13:09
WierdName
Inactive

Originally posted by ZIppyDSM:
...When it comes down to it its a crime,but its not worse than public drunkenness or fist fighting in public or any other "minor" crime that can net you a small fine and a vocal flogging from a judge.

Keep it simple people 5$USD for every minute captured or whatever the judge thinks is appropriate under the maxim(can not go over 5X 155 minutes) should be a reasonable charge,ya it sucks to cam in crappy quality a 600$ 2 hour movie but all in all the punishment fits the crime.

Or go with a 250 flat rate fine.

This crime is no worse than speeding, parking tickets and other lil things you get in trouble for, to send people to jail or comiunty service or 1000+ fines is foolish and shows how corrupted society has become..
My thoughts... mostly. It is stealing which is a little higher than a fist fight in public, but I would place it under speeding (way over the limit and not just 10MPH over) because you are endangering other's lives. Now if it's just some 10MPH over, then that would kinda be on the same level.

87.9.2007 13:13

Quote:
Originally posted by ZIppyDSM:
...When it comes down to it its a crime,but its not worse than public drunkenness or fist fighting in public or any other "minor" crime that can net you a small fine and a vocal flogging from a judge.

Keep it simple people 5$USD for every minute captured or whatever the judge thinks is appropriate under the maxim(can not go over 5X 155 minutes) should be a reasonable charge,ya it sucks to cam in crappy quality a 600$ 2 hour movie but all in all the punishment fits the crime.

Or go with a 250 flat rate fine.

This crime is no worse than speeding, parking tickets and other lil things you get in trouble for, to send people to jail or comiunty service or 1000+ fines is foolish and shows how corrupted society has become..
My thoughts... mostly. It is stealing which is a little higher than a fist fight in public, but I would place it under speeding (way over the limit and not just 10MPH over) because you are endangering other's lives. Now if it's just some 10MPH over, then that would kinda be on the same level.
Point is its a minor crime the media mafia is tryign to make worse than rape and murder...

97.9.2007 13:15
morguex
Inactive

Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
Originally posted by Mr-Movies:
Maybe we should make it the death penalty for those severe criminals cam'n the theater movies since they are a real plight on society. LOL

I think a day in jail is too much if their push wasn’t real hitting this would be just funny but it just doesn't stop and shows us how corrupt our systems really are.

So you're saying it should be perfectly legal for someone to steal what doesn't belong to them?
the problem is that camming a movie is not the same as breaking into the cinematographer's booth and stealing the reel of film. If someone did that, then there would be no question of theft. No matter how you look at it, copying just isn't the same as stealing. The word "Stealing" conjures up the image that the previous owner no longer has access to the object. That is simply not true in this case, and that is probably why so many people don't feel bad about making a copy. It doesn't deprive anyone else from enjoying the object.
Spin the words as you want... stealing is stealing. I can't understand why so many people go to such lengths just to try and justify it.
Says that from the man that has a tricked out 360,I am sorry you are breaking the media mafias law by playing back ups even if you own them or not :P

When it comes down to it its a crime,but its not worse than public drunkenness or fist fighting in public or any other "minor" crime that can net you a small fine and a vocal flogging from a judge.

Keep it simple people 5$USD for every minute captured or whatever the judge thinks is appropriate under the maxim(can not go over 5X 155 minutes) should be a reasonable charge,ya it sucks to cam in crappy quality a 600$ 2 hour movie but all in all the punishment fits the crime.

Or go with a 250 flat rate fine.

This crime is no worse than speeding, parking tickets and other lil things you get in trouble for, to send people to jail or comiunty service or 1000+ fines is foolish and shows how corrupted society has become..
Gotta love Zippydsm, he's the man. Thanks Zippy

107.9.2007 13:16
WierdName
Inactive

Originally posted by ZIppyDSM:
Point is its a minor crime the media mafia is tryign to make worse than rape and murder...
The point is they are trying to get you thrown in jail for years and years- which results in your permanent record being screwed up screwing up the rest of your life- for something you should get a fine and slap on the wrist for.

117.9.2007 14:24

most cams at the movie are a sad attempt to get something that is not worth watching just too crappy for me to even watch. some people need to get a life.

127.9.2007 15:29

I feel the same, the punishment has to match, to some degree the crime.
I think the MPAA people are aware of their overstepping, they are far from supid. My opinion is they have more on their mind than stopping camming. Once they get success with camming, then other more serious and adequate copying techniques might actually up the ante. Afterall, if camming gets you in a long jail sentence, then where does it go from there. Life in prison, or cut off the finger you use to operate your equipment.

137.9.2007 15:45

I believe if you are caught with a cam in the movie theaters your punishment should fit the crime.

The "cammer" should be forced to in a jail sell to watch horrible movies nonstop, kind of like the Clockwork Orange when they have the victims eyeballs opened, nice torture techniques. Nothing like forced to watch Gigli 27/7

http://www.imdb.com/chart/bottom

147.9.2007 16:47

A bigger question looms here. Has the MPAA produced anything lately worth the price of the blank media used to make these illegal recordings?

158.9.2007 0:10

The UK have more problems than worrying about cammers for the MPAA. Besides, in a country where torturing and killing a todler as a couple gets you 7 years, or driving drunk and crashing just gets a driving ban & fine (far more dangerous than camming!) just how many years in prison are the MPAA expecting the UK justice system to lock people up for?! lol

Besides, we get all the films about 2-4 weeks after the US anyway - and by that point there are 20 cams on newsgroups by US/Asian cammers.... so if its made a prisonable offence does this mean we will be getting films at the same time??

Did anybody catch the IT crowd last night?? They had the best piracy warning spoof in the world!! lol... "you wouldn't steal a policemans hat would you?? You wouldn't then shit in that policemans hat after shooting him would you?? You wouldn't then delivery that hat the to greaving policemans wife on the day of the funeral would you?? You wouldnt then steal the hat again would you?? No - then why steal films?? Piracy is stealing, you will be caught - and when you do, you will get what you deserve" ... then final scene was an FBI officer breaking into a little girls room room, shooting her in the back of the head, and blood running down the keyboard!! lol

168.9.2007 2:43

They want to imprison those camming villains. We do not have enough jail space. The way forward then ( how I love that sentence) would be for the MPAA to build their own prisons and pay for their maintenance, warders wages, bonuses and the like.Bonuses to be earned in the usual manner.

Patricia Hodge take note. Half the space to be taken up by rapists and axe murderers, the other half by cammers.

178.9.2007 5:45

I think the British goverment should concentrate on matters closer to home ...like the leading story in most UK newspapers today and try and put an end to the poor MADDIE McCANN tragedy ...NOW THATS A F**K*NG CRIME....and before you all start banging on i'm entitled to my opinion

188.9.2007 11:54

Originally posted by chinpark9:
The way forward then ( how I love that sentence) would be for the MPAA to build their own prisons and pay for their maintenance, warders wages, bonuses and the like.
I understand they are already in negotiation talks with the US government to take over Guantanamo Bay maybe they can change the name to Camtanamo Bay

198.9.2007 12:00
WierdName
Inactive

Quote:
Originally posted by chinpark9:
The way forward then ( how I love that sentence) would be for the MPAA to build their own prisons and pay for their maintenance, warders wages, bonuses and the like.
I understand they are already in negotiation talks with the US government to take over Guantanamo Bay maybe they can change the name to Camtanamo Bay
You sure? I heard they were gonna open up Alcatraz and just throw people out there. Then at the end of their sentence, they pull up to shore for 2 minutes and if they don't show up, they just leave them until someone else needs to get picked up, at which time they have another 2 minutes to get on board or be left behind again. Oh, right, there are no guards, provided food, or any other amenities.

Also, I just had a weird thought; what if someone made a movie about the MPAA's questionable actions. That would be ironic eh?

208.9.2007 16:55

Quote:
Spin the words as you want... stealing is stealing. I can't understand why so many people go to such lengths just to try and justify it.
Guys like you would imprison people for "stealing songs" from the radio by recording them. Please..get a clue.

218.9.2007 17:14

Quote:
Quote:
Spin the words as you want... stealing is stealing. I can't understand why so many people go to such lengths just to try and justify it.
Guys like you would imprison people for "stealing songs" from the radio by recording them. Please..get a clue.
So camming is not a crime?

Free over the air broadcast stuff is fair game, renting a limited amount of time in a theater with rules to follow(no talking/disturbing others,no pics/camming,ect)

I can see Pic taking some cam events as non harmful, every watch a moive with friends and you are the only ones watching it,be it late night or whatever, you take pics or cam sillyness things like that should be dismissed on sight as cheerfull exuberance not law breaking.

When it comes to filming the movie itself in the dark with the intention to copy it on a cam thats where a problem starts.

228.9.2007 19:44
WierdName
Inactive

Quote:
Quote:
Spin the words as you want... stealing is stealing. I can't understand why so many people go to such lengths just to try and justify it.
Guys like you would imprison people for "stealing songs" from the radio by recording them. Please..get a clue.
So camming a movie is the same as recording a song off the radio? In other words, recording a movie in the theater where cameras/camcorders are prohibited, is the same as recording a song off the radio that is freely broadcasted?

239.9.2007 1:50

Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
Spin the words as you want... stealing is stealing. I can't understand why so many people go to such lengths just to try and justify it.
Guys like you would imprison people for "stealing songs" from the radio by recording them. Please..get a clue.
So camming a movie is the same as recording a song off the radio? In other words, recording a movie in the theater where cameras/camcorders are prohibited, is the same as recording a song off the radio that is freely broadcasted?
That's not the point... most people wouldn't cam a film in the cinema, just a few dodgy people who do it for some unknown reason (status symbol??). In my mind, somebody camming a bad-quality copy of a film from inside a cinema is no where near as harmful to the UK public as a drunk-driver, a rapist, a child molester, a robber, somebody with a gun (illegal in the UK!).... so for some US body to dictate to us that we should be sending cammers to jail because it hurts them and yet we barely lock up all of the above is just stupid and arrogant. Our prisons are already overcrowded - if the movie industry think they have a problem with cammers in the UK (which I don't think there is - we get the films a month after anywhere else anyway, about the time DVD rips appear from the US alot of the time!), then they should do 1 of 3 things.

1 - Stop releasing films in the UK (not gonna happen!)
2 - Invest in better cinema security (it doesn't take much to white-out camera sensors with certain light wavelengths or frequencies).
3 - Watermark reels with cinema location and reel number (not gonna happen, these things get sent ad-hoc around the world, I know cos I used to work in a cinema - we used to get the US reels when they were done with them).

The watermark idea could happen when we shift from analogue to digital projectors fully.... but until then the best option is 2. Until they do that, they should stop trying to make governments and their citizens pay through taxes to punish people who hurt the MPAA's members bottom line!!

249.9.2007 13:44
WierdName
Inactive

Originally posted by AtiLaw:
That's not the point... most people wouldn't cam a film in the cinema, just a few dodgy people who do it for some unknown reason (status symbol??). In my mind, somebody camming a bad-quality copy of a film from inside a cinema is no where near as harmful to the UK public as a drunk-driver, a rapist, a child molester, a robber, somebody with a gun (illegal in the UK!).... so for some US body to dictate to us that we should be sending cammers to jail because it hurts them and yet we barely lock up all of the above is just stupid and arrogant. Our prisons are already overcrowded - if the movie industry think they have a problem with cammers in the UK (which I don't think there is - we get the films a month after anywhere else anyway, about the time DVD rips appear from the US alot of the time!), then they should do 1 of 3 things.

1 - Stop releasing films in the UK (not gonna happen!)
2 - Invest in better cinema security (it doesn't take much to white-out camera sensors with certain light wavelengths or frequencies).
3 - Watermark reels with cinema location and reel number (not gonna happen, these things get sent ad-hoc around the world, I know cos I used to work in a cinema - we used to get the US reels when they were done with them).

The watermark idea could happen when we shift from analogue to digital projectors fully.... but until then the best option is 2. Until they do that, they should stop trying to make governments and their citizens pay through taxes to punish people who hurt the MPAA's members bottom line!!
If that's not the point then where did the "stealing songs off the radio" come from? You seem to be jumping around a lot.

259.9.2007 16:46

my only question is who does the MPAA think they are? i live in the US and i think they have some balls goin after the rest of the world. last time i checked MPAA stood for motion picture association of AMERICA. not the entire world. if they dont want people stealing their movies in other countries then dont send the films there. if you send the films there to make an extra buck deal with what comes with it, dont try to change foriegn policy just because your losing a buck on a crappy film or 10.

269.9.2007 17:31
WierdName
Inactive

Originally posted by pcanisius:
my only question is who does the MPAA think they are? i live in the US and i think they have some balls goin after the rest of the world. last time i checked MPAA stood for motion picture association of AMERICA. not the entire world. if they dont want people stealing their movies in other countries then dont send the films there. if you send the films there to make an extra buck deal with what comes with it, dont try to change foriegn policy just because your losing a buck on a crappy film or 10.
Hmm, as another US resident, that sounds right. Thats something that comes with the territory of sending the product off to another country. Especially when that other country is known for making knockoffs or counterfeit merchandise.

279.9.2007 19:46

Its going to take forever for everyone to finally understand that types of media you can enjoy with your senses has to stop being a corporate "product" and be entertainment for all.

If they want profits they need to give you incentives to buy other physical products by using the media. Such as making deals with other companies where they get paid a share of what they help sell. Lets say Sony wants to sell their marketing failure ps3 for their top price? They offer the system with copies of the last 5 best box office rated Hollywood movies. Genius! It may be a bad example, but I'm not getting paid like a marketing big shot to come up with their ideas; and you get the idea anyway.

These morons are literally trying to put more people in our overflowing jails for stupid shit not even dangerous. We already get a ridiculous amount of people in jail just for HAVING "illegal" drugs, never mind buying or selling them. Whats up with that? War on Drugs is pointless. War on Media copy control is bullshit.

2810.9.2007 20:59

We have enough crimes on the books. This is a civil matter - camming is NOT a threat to society, so it doesn't need to be a criminal matter. Let the copyright holders bear the cost of protecting their investments - that's what a copyright is for, and the copyright owners' cost of doing business. It's not the taxpayers' responsibility to pay to prosecute cammers.

2910.9.2007 23:07

There is absolutely no way our british govt can start locking people up for this so called crime, we are already at breaking point in the prisons here the laws on copyright are as outdated as our politicians ,there's a whole new generation coming through where dll is the norm, in 10 years these are the people who will be running the country and hopefully commonsense will prevail and we will send the mpaa and their laws back where thy belong......... the dark ages

3011.9.2007 1:19

Over the last few days, reading diverse comments on those worthies from the MPAA, it has occurred that, no matter what one does, no matter how trivial, will be seen by someone or other as a terrible crime.

Those who would criminalise these bagatelles, tend to live in chateaux surrounded bu moats,out of the reach of the common man, away from the grass roots, only to peer at the peasants from the battlements when there is something that can be denied them. And then it is called law and order, and fighting crime, etc,etc.

3111.9.2007 1:44

this is nothing special it was going to occur its wat they want to do is take over the world like this.

3211.9.2007 1:46

Quote:
Originally posted by chinpark9:
The way forward then ( how I love that sentence) would be for the MPAA to build their own prisons and pay for their maintenance, warders wages, bonuses and the like.
I understand they are already in negotiation talks with the US government to take over Guantanamo Bay maybe they can change the name to Camtanamo Bay
I would have thought pirate bay would be more fitting.

3312.9.2007 11:23
procode
Inactive

Having a knife in your kitchen is illegal too, if you one day kill someone with it .. !!

Taking video clips in a cinema does not mean that you will eventually record the whole film, nor, ‘even if you did’, that you will manufacture a complete & watchable film from it .. !!

And even if you did, it does not mean that you will create thousands, and sell them .. !!


Many years ago, I took 15 seconds of 'actual film' footage of a film being shown at a local cinema, I had no intention of selling it, nor in any way making ANY monetary profit from it, it was simply an experiment, to see if the reflected light was strong enough to be captured ..

As far as I am concerned, it was pure education, just a tiny example of what made me ‘who I am’ today ..

Perhaps I’d better check in at a local Crown Court, and plan to stay with them for the next ten years .. ??

3412.9.2007 12:17

We are taking this far too casually. Reading the contributions made by the members in this forum, I had this picture comparing the dear departed, Adolf and his cohorts, and the good burghers at the MPAA.It is a stretch. Adolf did it with tanks, and Stukas and fokkers(Focke-Wulfes) to the cognoscenti, and I cannot really compare that to using existing or wished for laws, just to deprive the grass roots of their liberty. Still and all, if you have money, which you got from the likes of us, in the first instance, it is only just that you should try and get more.

Maybe the old Chancellor should take lessons. He had his hands in our pockets for years, and here comes this neo na.... with novel methods of depriving us of our cash.

3512.9.2007 12:21

Originally posted by chinpark9:
We are taking this far too casually. Reading the contributions made by the members in this forum, I had this picture comparing the dear departed, Adolf and his cohorts, and the good burghers at the MPAA.It is a stretch. Adolf did it with tanks, and Stukas and fokkers(Focke-Wulfes) to the cognoscenti, and I cannot really compare that to using existing or wished for laws, just to deprive the grass roots of their liberty. Still and all, if you have money, which you got from the likes of us, in the first instance, it is only just that you should try and get more.

Maybe the old Chancellor should take lessons. He had his hands in our pockets for years, and here comes this neo na.... with novel methods of depriving us of our cash.
*in the style of William Wallace*
Freeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeedommmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm

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