AfterDawn: Tech news

UK ISPs join up for piracy crackdown

Written by Andre Yoskowitz (Google+) @ 24 Jul 2008 10:06 User comments (63)

UK ISPs join up for piracy crackdown England's six largest ISPs have all joined together with the government to "clamp down" on unauthorized downloading of music and movies.
Estimates have suggested that 6.5 million British citizens have downloaded unauthorized files over the last year and that piracy will cost the music industry £1 billion over the next five years.

The new clamp down will begin with thousands of warning letter informing alleged users that their illegal activity has been detected and that they are now being monitored.

The Governments business department will sign the industry agreement soon with BT, Virgin Media, Orange, Tiscali, BSkyB and Carphone Warehouse.

All the ISPs have committed to developing legal file-sharing services, with perhaps the option of users paying extra per month to the ISPs to download unlimited legal music.

There was no word yet on what sanctions would happen to persistent online pirates but ideas that have been thrown around are the so-called "three strikes" law or additional broadband fees for heavy users.

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63 user comments

124.7.2008 10:49
masa92
Inactive

Originally posted by DVDBack23:
..will cost the music industry £1 billion over the next five years.
I can't understand were do they pull these numbers, because I don't think that everybody who downloads pirated music, would have bought the CD. And maybe the cost of the war against piratism is waaay bigger.

224.7.2008 11:33

They should be clamping down more on illegal immigrants and worrying more about terrorism soon as I get 1 letter ill be taking my hard earned cash somewhere else and if I keep getting them ill just cancel the internet roll on the next election and good bye Gordon brown nice to see our government have got there priorities in order catch illegal downloader’s but let any Fu@@ jump over the fence and bleed our system dry with free hand outs

324.7.2008 11:41

Wow, this is really bad. I live in the U.S. and I know we are going to be next. Goodbye freedom.

They will have to send out thousands of warning letters, that can't be cheap, all at the expense of the citizens. Why not send out emails, I'm sure they will have access to it with their monitoring software.

424.7.2008 12:05

Someone(everyone) just has to upload legal-linux on bittorrent. Then let's see what they will say. :D

524.7.2008 12:15

thats bad for the UK but i am sure that this must have so many holes that no one will ever get punished.
Dont know what is exactly the law in uk , but as long as you dont sell /have profit from what you DL they cant put you in jail cause you have DL something.
anyway, this will push more people to Rapidshare etc.

624.7.2008 12:17

Quote:
All the ISPs have committed to developing legal file-sharing services, with perhaps the option of users paying extra per month to the ISPs to download unlimited legal music.
This is so full of fail...a fillet fish chok full of it. You cant compete with free. If I buy a CD and want to share it with my friends, that is my business. This whole thing reminds me of when the Bioshock DRM fiasco happened and some 2K goon on the forums said "why should your brother get to play for free?"

Asshats.

724.7.2008 12:27

Originally posted by DVDBack23:
..will cost the music industry £1 billion over the next five years.
£1 billion that record execs. and performers can't spend on cocaine

824.7.2008 12:34

Originally posted by rkan:
Someone(everyone) just has to upload legal-linux on bittorrent. Then let's see what they will say. :D

That's my plan just to p*ss them off. Will this affect users that encrypt there connections in uTorrent or Azureus?

924.7.2008 12:40

Note...this is just an idea...might not work...Cheers!
=========================================================
Maybe breaking things up might help instead of using 1 file...
For example:
a)Usually 1 file contains everything you need, like:
Al Green - Greatest Hits.torrent

b)So you download it and you get three seperate codes that you will
need to put together at the end to make it work..like:
p29eirh3f82o02a.rar
ppjew93nj20iofs.rar
pppow029jh2f9fv.rar
... or maybe torrents....
p29eirh3f82o02a.torrent
ppjew93nj20iofs.torrent
pppow029jh2f9fv.torrent
... and inside are the "rar" files that you are downloading.

c) When they are all downloaded, you can rejoin them all and you
will have your "original" Al Green - Greatest Hits music!
========================================================

...just a thought. But if you are using "excessive bandwidth" one might be more "closely" watched than others.
Cheers!

1024.7.2008 12:57

That's a fairly good idea rlessmue. It's a triumph of common sense over technology however I don't think it will catch on (or might but only in a limited number of torrents).

1124.7.2008 14:16
westbrom
Inactive

WHAT happens when 90 percent of the users that dload have to disconnect from the isp and they lose loads of money
also we need something to block our ips or stop them tracking torrents

1224.7.2008 15:30

i say everyone should just download as much as they do and more if possible. there would of course be a blackout period eventually where all but a few people will have been banned from using the net at which point isp's will be going broke and have to end all the bans to keep in buisiness.

THEY CANT BAN EVERYONE. its just not good for buisiness lol



infact technically its the ditribution (uploading) that they get pissy over, i know it would destroy download speeds if everyone in the UK stopped seeding torrents they were downloading, but if theres a way you can completely stop seeding and still be able to download (slowley) then what can they do, no one could be charged with distributing copyrighted material which would leave them with no choice other than to ban users, which again is not good for buisiness when you have banned all your customers.

This message has been edited since its posting. Latest edit was made on 24 Jul 2008 @ 15:34

1324.7.2008 15:49

you cant stop whats free,dosnt matter how many toes you stand on gettin there

make dvds and music free and just tax the tools we use to download and copy them

then the money from the taxed things throw in a pot for the people who make the movies and music..

make torrents total download the true top 10 and share the money to the people at the top of the list.. easy

then you would filter all the crap hollywood movies they would bring out.. Batman has just made millions there is no problem

russia release there dvd releases soon after they release it at cinema to reduce pirate dvds. good idea also

1424.7.2008 15:51

With all the things going on in the world and the in the UK, you would think they had higher priorties. Still given the lack of competence they have already showed in the past - I doubt they will get this right.

1524.7.2008 16:01

i gotta agree with killalot, i cant see how the government find a few sites with free music is more important than illegal immigrants and terrorism.

1624.7.2008 16:01
varnull
Inactive

FFS.. we give taxpayers legal aid to enemies of britain and murders etc to stay here.. wanted and convicted criminals where they come from are living in the UK at taxpayers expense.. and what gets said about that? NOTHING!!

So newsgroups and xdcc.. with the pedos and terrorists.. iws where they will push us.. wow, just what we need.. another bunch of technically aware and skilled pissed off people.. I say lets target the UK financial institutions with ddos and other nasty tricks.. most of us have stolen connections.. we don't need these shitty criminal isp's and unelected asshat politicians dictating to us any more.

They can't sort out the big problems of drug, gun and knife crime.. so lets just piss everybody off so we can impose martial law eh?

When they catch me.. the ip they will get relates to a .gov domain.. lets see eh?

Welcome to the darknet ;)

1724.7.2008 16:07

on torrent sites now, (Some) they have put encryption on your data so isp's cant read the data.but some websites do require paying.

1824.7.2008 16:34

varnull-if only there was a way of getting tht through 2 the government

1924.7.2008 17:06
dcity
Inactive

LOL aaaaaggghh woops i was downloading a movie as i discovered this article on the main page :O unbelievable!!! i wonder if this will move on to other countries??

2024.7.2008 17:09

Originally posted by akira247:
then you would filter all the crap hollywood movies they would bring out.. Batman has just made millions there is no problem
But that's just it. There is a problem in their eyes. Because they feel that piracy causes the industry to lose millions more. If Batman makes $300 million, there is always the statement, "well, it could make $300 million more" if people didn't "pirate." The thought isn't how much a movie makes....it's how much more a movie can make, or anything else for that matter. Nobody is calling out the makers of these absurd claims of billions in lost revenue, so these absurd claims are starting to become engraved in stone because every media organization is making them, and the government is now backing these claims.

Reasoning that "making XX amount of millions should be good enough" doesn't fly with Capitalism. Everyone has the right to make as much money as possible, and anything or anyone that gets in the way can get crushed in the blink of an eye. There is no such thing as fair use if it "infringes" on someones right to make money. So we had better get used to it because the hammer is dropping.
This message has been edited since its posting. Latest edit was made on 24 Jul 2008 @ 17:10

2124.7.2008 17:25

well im not sure, but over in this country torrents and file sharing (P2P) is illegal.in other countries it is ok so it will not happen

2224.7.2008 17:38

ok but have u eva played a dvd and it comes up wiv a warning saying no copying or viewing without the owners permission n all tht crap.
well wen u r hosting ur music and dvds on the net u r basicaly giving permission for people to download it n stuff. u wouldnt host sumin on the net then complain u didnt giv permission to them.

2324.7.2008 17:46

I hate it that nobody ever just places facts in front of these money grabbing fagins, they have nothing, it is a non-argument that they WILL win.

http://www.imdb.com/boxoffice/alltimegross?region=world-wide

Ok, look at the dates on those films, do they look like BT effected them in any way? Titanic is a fluke, who knows why that took so much cash, so they cant say all those films would have topped Titanic given BT not leaching them. How is Dark knight breaking all records when it is on every single Torrent site?

Putting this argument down isn't difficult.

A penny lost on a Billion is still a penny lost to these jokers, and that is the crux of the problem, they just want total control of everything so they can get back to manipulating viewing habits and making cheap horrible films that all make a profit. They can dress it up however they want.

2424.7.2008 19:09

hey why?
the gov do catch the crime in the street they waited they time on internet what a f$%& what they wanted

2524.7.2008 19:56

demonnews FTW with SSL encrypted downloads for me :)

yes say im using alot of bandwitdh but they wont be able to monitor what i dld :)

2624.7.2008 21:47

i find it worrisome whenever i see the phrase, "it wasn't authorized" or "has this been authorized". Stick the word "authorize" into anything and you know that someone is taking control away from you or has taken control away from you. It's kind of at odds with that other word "responsibility" except you can't be considered "responsible" unless you have been "authorized" by someone else.

Example: You are expected to behave in a responsible manner (do what we say and don't download except in such manners as we authorize). You have to be responsible for your own behaviour but you cannot define what responsible is - we will do that for you.

They say, Our ability to make money is being interfered with by people who are not being responsible, that is, who accept and conform to the same value-base that places money above all else.
The trouble is that other people are not behaving responsibly (the want we want them to) so we need to persuade then coerce (if persuade doesn't work or i am just feeling like not being nice and showing how tough i am). They haven't formed a group yet? Then let's force them into forming a group e.g. Association of Independent ISP's and then force THEM to behave responsibly so that we can gradually build up a flock of people who behave responsibly (remember, those who are coerced into conformity) and then we will force other groups e.g. politicians, lawmakers, people who see another opportunity to make money e.g. new types of agents and reps.
Hmm, we will still and then go after the widows mite's though as they add up after all a million cents is still a very large number that looks impressive.

And all the time the enforcement of conformity is applied and strains the fabric of society in the move to make money. What is there about us as a species that lets us do these sorts of things to each other? Dpon't be a goody twoshoes about it. Find out what it is, accept it, love it, BY NO MEANS TRY TO REMOVE IT (that would be us fighting us, but maybe we can turn it so we all benefit (small "b").

(Yes, there are huge holes and i have left reams out). Good innit?

2724.7.2008 22:22
susieqbbb
Inactive

Ok you dont want people in europe to pirate music then make music cheaper my friend has family over europe and when he got back he was so glad to be back on u.s soil he purchased only one item while there a music cd at $50.00 u.s you want to stop piracy then make things cheaper.

2825.7.2008 2:10

It’s got nothing to do with illegal downloads or pirates taking over the internet what I do in my house is my own business a mans house his is castle its spying on you if I go on the Argos now will they be taking notes thanks Mr Brown for taking some more of my privileges away on the bright side Labour just lost another bye election so wont be long before his travelling circus will be out of office just make sure folks the next election get out and vote if you need a lift to the polling station I’ll give you a lift

2925.7.2008 2:27

How will they be able to stop everyone?
if people want to download then there will always be a way to do it.
There is no way this "government" will get this right. they have messed everything else up that they have touched in the last few years

3025.7.2008 3:59

hi as soon as i found this out i downloaded a program from TPB called invisible browsing this changes my ip address so no one can trace what im downloading

3125.7.2008 4:28

Quote:
England's six largest ISPs have all joined together with the government to "clamp down" on unauthorized downloading of music and movies.
im sure England has more than 6 ISP's, well i kno australia has

y not just go 2 one of the smaller 1's that dont care wot you do on

the internet.

@rlessmue

very nice idea i would do it :)

...BUT how would you know which 3 or so you need 2 DL?
This message has been edited since its posting. Latest edit was made on 25 Jul 2008 @ 7:45

3225.7.2008 7:12
psplvanub
Inactive

these are just the 6 largest isp's in england

3325.7.2008 7:40
blueroad
Inactive

hmm remember the article where BT said they will not lie down flat for these b*tches? well didnt take them long enough to let themselves get raped by the movie and music industry..and frankly i dont think all kinds of ip blockers will continue to work..since its downloadable its no problem to dl and hack it then when the ISP sees that he cannot tell what your IP is he'll run thru all kinds of hackin programs and it will be like cracking DRM only the opposite-we do the encrypting and they do the hacking..i think the best method would be to pirate unanimously because as the few wiser people here said they cant ban everyone or even 20% of theyre users cuz anyway most users that pirate alot hav high bandwith which means more money for the ISP and therfore the ISP will not favor the music/film industry over their own profit

so keep up the seeding and downloading :)
they CANT stop us XD

3425.7.2008 11:17

i say we get rid of the f**king government, this country will do betta without it.
and the government will never be able to tackle with piracy and stuff because they have tried it be4 and never worked

3525.7.2008 13:10

Quote:
Quote:
England's six largest ISPs have all joined together with the government to "clamp down" on unauthorized downloading of music and movies.
im sure England has more than 6 ISP's, well i kno australia has

y not just go 2 one of the smaller 1's that dont care wot you do on

the internet.

@rlessmue

very nice idea i would do it :)

...BUT how would you know which 3 or so you need 2 DL?

===============
My "best" guess would be that someone would have to make two programs:
1) a program that would make the torrent that would have you
enter a short code (like: a2DF5 ) as part of the code to
associate all the parts together. At the time of posting,
this code would be know - and would have to be seen by
"human eyes" to be written down (in order to join the
sections together again). Why? My guess is that most of
the tracking is done automatic, and it would take too much
effort to verify all the postings and gathering the codes.
2) another program is needed (it could be part of the same program.
This allows you to put in your code in, and it would then find
all the parts, and put the correct parts back together again.

My "guess" is the best way for this to work is that durning the build
of the torrent, this program splits it into multiple torrents, which
you would know at the time of downloading (maybe after sending it
through one of the programs and putting in the code).

The "origial" posting would be maybe something like this:
Complete U2 Discography - 18 CD's
Torrent link (you would click on the link)
Code: 34DF56xi

After clicking on the link you would receive a small torrent file.
You would then run this link through "the program" - but you must
then enter the "code" (34DF56xi) to get the information. Without the
code you would not get the information.

The information you would get is, maybe three or more links that you would down load (as you would a normal torrent). Names of these
would be like:
oiqopivnq93276.rar
fjq8-gn04830og.rar
3nsbpog828-2to.rar

When you finish downloading the three "rar" files (just an example),
you would use "the program" again to "merge" them back together again
to what the original poster had made...the U2 cd's.
===============================================
This is the basic idea...I'm not a programmer guy.
So, anyone for else for it? We could call them "torrent2" files...for multiple files!
Cheers!

3625.7.2008 13:24

i see were ur coming from but it will be 2 much hassel, the data will not be readable once downloaded and put together agen,(possibly)
and the isp's will still find u downloading illegally unless u can make somekind of p2p for torrents only just like a torrent website but as a p2p network.isp's dont see things like limewire or p2p software because u r not going online onto websites.

3725.7.2008 13:54

Originally posted by david94:
i say we get rid of the f**king government, this country will do betta without it.
and the government will never be able to tackle with piracy and stuff because they have tried it be4 and never worked
Er..yeah! Lets get rid of the government! Who needs roads, sewage treatment, water, electricity, and lets not forget the military. Navy SEALs and Green Berets aren't corporations you know..and no one is better at fighting terrorists than them.

3825.7.2008 13:57

well y then do they suddenly think tht a little free music is more important than immigrants and terrorists coming into this country.

3925.7.2008 14:11

Originally posted by david94:
i see were ur coming from but it will be 2 much hassel, the data will not be readable once downloaded and put together agen,(possibly)
and the isp's will still find u downloading illegally unless u can make somekind of p2p for torrents only just like a torrent website but as a p2p network.isp's dont see things like limewire or p2p software because u r not going online onto websites.

==========
...as for the "2 much hassel" - what is'nt now days LOL! People have
been know to put-up with all kinds of cr*p to get what they need.
...I'm sure isp's will always see something...but if they can only
see "garbage" then the only way would be is that amount of bandwidth
that you are using...which could raise a "level of question" in
their minds. Although you might be using something like limewire to
hide your p2p, the amount of traffic you a using/generating is up for
question...and might raise the "red flag" when they start looking.
...just an idea for these issues.
Cheers!

4025.7.2008 14:20

since isp's cant see wot ur downloading wen u use limewire, i think it would be a good idea if u could have something like limewire but for torrents only, so u can carry on downloading ur torrents into woteva bittorrent software u use.but isp's cant see wot it is, only bandwith.

4125.7.2008 15:33
blueroad
Inactive

LOL limewire..

4226.7.2008 1:03

rlessmue idea

does any 1 kno how hard this would b 2 make?

because if we tell the right people like the people who make utorrent, azureus...etc we could get this of the ground?

[url=http://forums.afterdawn.com/thread_view.cfm/686421][/url]

This message has been edited since its posting. Latest edit was made on 26 Jul 2008 @ 1:13

4326.7.2008 3:12

Has the “Mods” been in half of the comments on this thread have been deleted freedom of speech Afterdawn or have we lost that as well?

4426.7.2008 13:17
blueroad
Inactive

Originally posted by killalot:
Has the “Mods” been in half of the comments on this thread have been deleted freedom of speech Afterdawn or have we lost that as well?
umm i think your grammar needs a bit of work

4526.7.2008 14:21

limewire fine if you only want music but to dl films and games you should use tpb and seeing as gamesw like medal of honour airbourne and prince caspian game r a 6-7 gb download then u have to use tpb with utorrent or azures limewire except for music is full of virusses
so get invisible browsing and use tpb happy dl enjoy

4626.7.2008 15:04

Quote:
Originally posted by killalot:
Has the “Mods” been in half of the comments on this thread have been deleted freedom of speech Afterdawn or have we lost that as well?
umm i think your grammar needs a bit of work
Umm what’s that? What a prick. which part don’t you understand.

4726.7.2008 15:37
blueroad
Inactive

Quote:
Quote:
Originally posted by killalot:
Has the “Mods” been in half of the comments on this thread have been deleted freedom of speech Afterdawn or have we lost that as well?
umm i think your grammar needs a bit of work
Umm what’s that? What a prick. which part don’t you understand.
hmm sorry didnt mean to hurt your feelings or anything.. but you missed out on some words or i dont know maybe itll be better read with punctuation..but i dont get anything of what you tried to convey, not a clue..

4826.7.2008 16:25

wot dont you get you THICKO

4926.7.2008 16:26

sorry u dont get r u a newbie or something ohh u r arnt u

5026.7.2008 16:32

removed by loco

This message has been edited since its posting. Latest edit was made on 26 Jul 2008 @ 18:50

5126.7.2008 17:09

if ur gonna start sumin lik dis up then do it somewere else

5226.7.2008 17:52

Originally posted by blueroad:
Quote:
Quote:
Originally posted by killalot:
Has the “Mods” been in half of the comments on this thread have been deleted freedom of speech Afterdawn or have we lost that as well?
umm i think your grammar needs a bit of work
Umm what’s that? What a prick. which part don’t you understand.
hmm sorry didnt mean to hurt your feelings or anything.. but you missed out on some words or i dont know maybe itll be better read with punctuation..but i dont get anything of what you tried to convey, not a clue..

Mods = Moderators Admin = Administrators If you had been on this topic since it was active you would have realised some of the comments have been deleted go back to your dark room and masturbate over ?????? “Fool”

Happy get a grip as well
This message has been edited since its posting. Latest edit was made on 03 Aug 2008 @ 12:15

5326.7.2008 18:56

But I've only just arrived to find 3 kiddies need to put toys back in pram.



5427.7.2008 13:41

sorry didnt mean to get suspended but some people really hack me off can only take so much

5527.7.2008 14:56

hi culpeck back i get suspended fine but the kiilalot mentions kiddie porn should be banned for life sick any one who even mentions or suggests i go and watch it does he realise the trauma these kids are put through so y isnt he banned for life killalot you need help

5627.7.2008 16:25

iv got to agree "kiddie porn", thts just over the top and sick.

5728.7.2008 1:00
varnull
Inactive

Ok kids... check it out..

http://www.theregister.co.uk/2008/07/25/...es_dead_hurrah/

Looks like our constant bickering at and harassment of OUR representatives has had an effect.

victory is ours

Now when we get these threatening letters lets DEMAND to see actual proof that we downloaded and uploaded infringing content... then invoke the "court order needed to run electronic surveillance unless in interests of national security" law... hahahahaha.. that's going to be fun.. They have to admit breaking the "right to privacy of electronic communications" laws (a criminal offence) to accuse us of a little bit of copyright infringement (a civil misdemeanour)

Give it up already.. you have lost before you start. I can see the smaller isp's getting big quickly....

BTW.. this year Branson replaces Noel Edmonds in the "which smug beardy idiot do you want to kick in the nuts?" challenge which is held on one of my sites every xmas. XD

This message has been edited since its posting. Latest edit was made on 28 Jul 2008 @ 1:43

5828.7.2008 14:18
varnull
Inactive

awwww... cmon.. a colleague posts great info like that and you guys sit back and don't mention it.. we wins.. we says arse!.. and big ups to Fergal for being still punk as f---

5929.7.2008 7:18

For those saying lets switch to a limewire type system - it would be pointless.

The system so far works like this:

- BPI monitor bittorrent users as a downloader/uploader themselves, they log the IP addresses of those who connect to them downloading or uploading, it doesn't really matter now.

- BPI pass the IP address, time/date, and file to the ISP who owns that IP pool

- ISP digs out the logs of who was using that IP address at the time/date the BPI claim, and send you 2 letters - one from them, and one from the BPI, and you also get a counter increment for copyright infringement.

So - if you use limewire - they will do the same thing, just stick files for download on that system, and wait for you to connect to the BPI's computer to download and log your info.

It doesn't matter if your connection between you and the BPI is encrypted on bitorrent or limewire, they know your IP address and the file you are downloading because you are connecting to them!!

So in this system the ISP's arn't monitoring anything, the ISP's arn't giving out your details to the BPI (yet), and all the BPI know is that one of their trusted ISP's had an illegal downloader and that downloader should now be sufficiently scared not to do it again. If they do, then the ISP will deal with the messy work of disconnecting them, without any messy court fee's or having to prove anything.

Eventually all the other ISP's need to sign up to the same system, otherwise the government have threatened legislation to force them to sign up to a system of the governments choice, which so far involves some mystical filtering technology that hasn't been proven to work or even exist (our politicians believe anything dodgy IT or media companies tell them).

The BPI have already won... we are sort of screwed - as far as p2p is concerned anyway.

Now we need to switch to darknets and usenet type systems, where you only download from a pool of trusted people or a trusted server using encrypted connections - or you come up with a new p2p client that somehow anonomises ip addresses by using proxys.

There is another option though - for somebody unfairly sent a letter and disconnected, then for that person to have enough money to hire solicitors to sue the crap out of the BPI for wrongful termination of their internet connection (when they start that round), and for the government to put the burden of truth on the BPI - then it becomes too expensive for the BPI to follow this route.

Until then, it's trail without jury, the BPI claims an IP address (easily spoofed) was downloading something at a certain time, and whether you were or not if you had that IP address at the time you are deemed guilty and the letters or disconnection follows, no recourse, no messy proof!!

6029.7.2008 7:49

rlessmue, not everyone lives in England. Also many torrent users do not pay attention to much so they would be completely confused by your scheme. As proof of torrent user ignorance, try turning on the encryption on your torrent client. If you do that the ISPs can still tell you are using torrents but they will not know what you are downloading.

As for going to simple P2P like Limewire. They are the ones getting sued. There have not been any torrent users sued to my knollage. Why go after totrrent users when you can pick off persons asking to be caught.

6129.7.2008 8:06

How about Virgin media and bskyb tv channels try and give us american tv programs when they get shown in america instead of having to wait 6 months. That would reduce tv program downloads which would be better for them but NO. They have to help the government charge little sally downloading music for her ipod while the big pirating operations go unchecked. I also read somewhere that JOSS STONE doesn't care if you download her music illegally as long as you hear it and visit her shows. Why aren't all artists like her? To answer my own question, it wouldn't matter what they thought cos the producers and all that would complain and say we don't get enough money. Simon cowell has so much he gave smething like $80,000 to some people to pay there mortgage off cos there child was sick.

And even if you end up going to court for downloading, its gonna be a hefty fine and then you can go home. This is the government gaining back some of that 1Billion. Also stop giving imagrants so much money, money for a car, which they sell for a profit and buy some more and do they same again, money to live on every two weeks, I heard a rumour they get extra to "socialise" - go down the pub.

Quote:
well y then do they suddenly think tht a little free music is more important than immigrants and terrorists coming into this country.
Its to hard they send immigrants home but they just end up staying illegally. And who needs them, we should use the australian immigration policy.


I think i'm done :)

6229.7.2008 9:11

the mpaa have hired a hacker to spy on thepiratebay.org

6314.11.2010 17:14
goldilocksrocks
Inactive

The politics may change, but the wellspring remains the same. , <a href="http://xkelvj.dubodyl.co.cc/www.stokesk12.nc.us.com.html">www.stokesk12.nc.us.com</a>, www.stokesk12.nc.us.com, http://xkelvj.dubodyl.co.cc/www.stokesk12.nc.us.com.html www.stokesk12.nc.us.com, 248988,

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