AfterDawn: Tech news

Chinese citizens angry over Microsoft anti-piracy tactics

Written by Andre Yoskowitz (Google+) @ 19 Oct 2008 18:42 User comments (59)

Chinese citizens angry over Microsoft anti-piracy tactics According to a report from China.org.cn, Chinese citizens are upset over Microsoft's latest anti-piracy tactics.
The software giant is bringing its Microsoft Windows Genuine Advantage (WGA) and Office Genuine Advantage (OGA) software to China next week, but the software will be more intrusive then it is for US users.

Users of pirated Windows will see reminders every few hours that they should purchase legitimate software and occasionally the software will turn your screen black. A Microsoft official described it this way:

"The user may reset the background to a wallpaper or another background color, but every 60 minutes, the desktop will be reset to a plain black color until the copy of Windows passes validation. In addition, a persistent notification will appear in the lower right corner of the desktop."

Luckily for Chinese pirates, the software is opt-in so if they do not want it they do not have to download it.

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59 user comments

119.10.2008 18:56

jesus christ! What's wrong with these people

219.10.2008 19:06

If your a pirate turn off auto update, dont complain. Who are the biggest complainers? Pirates

319.10.2008 19:15

Considering China is a pirates haven; this is perfectly acceptable from M$. If anything I wouldn't mind seeing this being implemented everywhere. Its actually quite clever, they can still use the software, it just makes it annoying to use.

If they implemented something like this for games it would be good aswell. Such as games not saving after 30 minutes of constant game play if it isn't legit!

419.10.2008 19:32
varnull
Inactive

hahahaha.. My wga cracker trojan came from China :)

519.10.2008 19:42

I bet someone makes a program to automatically reapply your background every 60 minutes. No doubt in my mind that a program like that will appear.

619.10.2008 21:11

Originally posted by PeaInAPod:
I bet someone makes a program to automatically reapply your background every 60 minutes. No doubt in my mind that a program like that will appear.
You could probably reset it using the registry and/or group policy settings.

719.10.2008 21:23

Originally posted by varnull:
hahahaha.. My wga cracker trojan came from China :)

Ain't that the truth !

"The flimsier the product,the higher the price"
Ferengi 82nd rule of aqusition


819.10.2008 21:59

I don't download M$ CorruptDates. No problems! I don't use IE! Ha ha haaa!

919.10.2008 23:51

Originally posted by PeaInAPod:
I bet someone makes a program to automatically reapply your background every 60 minutes. No doubt in my mind that a program like that will appear.
Applications that do that have existed for ages now.

1020.10.2008 4:42

"Luckily for Chinese pirates, the software is opt-in so if they do not want it they do not have to download it."

Not really, if you don't opt in you can't download any updates and even using IE to get updates, won't allow the update website to open up properly.

1120.10.2008 5:30
13thHouR
Inactive

Good lets hope that Linux will see a sharp rise in users to make other companies take heed to the growing popularity of open source software and ditch the overpriced monopolistic corporate scum.

This message has been edited since its posting. Latest edit was made on 20 Oct 2008 @ 5:31

1220.10.2008 5:38
fgamer
Inactive

Thank god they're not so abusive when it comes down to console piracy.

1320.10.2008 8:43

Bill Gates is a greedy moron and M$ is an illegal monopoly . . .

1420.10.2008 12:33

Originally posted by fgamer:
Thank god they're not so abusive when it comes down to console piracy.
Did you forget about bans on Xbox Live, which is a pay service?

1520.10.2008 12:40
varnull
Inactive

I think they have... but that's not so much M$ as it is the game publishers. Think about it from M$ perspective.. you go pirate a game and then pay $xxx dollars a year for the live account to play it online.. That doesn't hurt M$ at all.. It probably costs them a fair chunk to implement systems to detect non-original media.. and to have at least 1 staff to run the ban process every month.. looks to me like 1 person anyway by the long gaps between ban outings.

Open Source numbers continue to rise.. fista is the best thing that ever happened for linux/bsd. In fact IMHO it's only an idiot who buys M$ software these days to be called a thief and a pirate every 30 minutes.
I install stolen XP all the time.. wpa and wga cracks, disable the auto updates (by messing up the url's it hunts for.. hex editor and skillz needed) and away they go for months and months of hassle free XP using.. poor n00bs. I feel real bad perpetuating the sheeple drone M$ users by helping them... but honestly.. they are too programmed and thick to use anything else (even though windows is hard to use, old fashioned and clunky)
Re-education is required.. in a big way... Starting in schools.. we must make it clear that using proprietary software in so called "IT" courses is rubbish. Kids only know how to use M$ software.. and then go looking for employment in places that use unix/linux/solaris... and they don't have a clue without that sodding paper clip telling them what to do every 10 seconds.
I know I know.. school isn't to educate.. it's to program the next generation of non thinking consumers.. but really.......

This message has been edited since its posting. Latest edit was made on 20 Oct 2008 @ 12:48

1620.10.2008 12:53

Originally posted by catfreak:
Bill Gates is a greedy moron and M$ is an illegal monopoly . . .
WTF...Bill Gates Was the only decent one there.

1720.10.2008 16:28

I've never had a problem with the WGA thingee...
First of all, I wouldn't install Vista if it was the only OS I had..
I know people who install XP with easy to get cracks that updates just fine.
Same with Office. If I can find it then some Chineese hack job can find it.

Let M$ do whatever they want. It'll get hacked in due time.

Install Open Office!!!

1820.10.2008 18:04

Originally posted by catfreak:
Bill Gates is a greedy moron and M$ is an illegal monopoly . . .
Does Bill Gates even work at Microsoft anymore? I thought he retired.

1920.10.2008 23:50

When Obama's elected, everything wil be free, everywhere.

2021.10.2008 2:54

Originally posted by mspurloc:
When Obama's elected, everything wil be free, everywhere.
hahaha what does that mean? he's go my vote

2121.10.2008 4:21

Originally posted by varnull:
I think they have... but that's not so much M$ as it is the game publishers. Think about it from M$ perspective.. you go pirate a game and then pay $xxx dollars a year for the live account to play it online.. That doesn't hurt M$ at all.. It probably costs them a fair chunk to implement systems to detect non-original media.. and to have at least 1 staff to run the ban process every month.. looks to me like 1 person anyway by the long gaps between ban outings.

Open Source numbers continue to rise.. fista is the best thing that ever happened for linux/bsd. In fact IMHO it's only an idiot who buys M$ software these days to be called a thief and a pirate every 30 minutes.
I install stolen XP all the time.. wpa and wga cracks, disable the auto updates (by messing up the url's it hunts for.. hex editor and skillz needed) and away they go for months and months of hassle free XP using.. poor n00bs. I feel real bad perpetuating the sheeple drone M$ users by helping them... but honestly.. they are too programmed and thick to use anything else (even though windows is hard to use, old fashioned and clunky)
Re-education is required.. in a big way... Starting in schools.. we must make it clear that using proprietary software in so called "IT" courses is rubbish. Kids only know how to use M$ software.. and then go looking for employment in places that use unix/linux/solaris... and they don't have a clue without that sodding paper clip telling them what to do every 10 seconds.
I know I know.. school isn't to educate.. it's to program the next generation of non thinking consumers.. but really.......
LOL I haven't read so much crap in a long time. Hehe good job you made me laugh.

2221.10.2008 5:17
cousinkix
Inactive

How ironic. A Chinese warez site is one of the first to have the latest cracks for this Windows Genuine Advantage anti-piracy software, when it comes out. They are usually just a day behind Micro$oft. The new crack is there right now...

This message has been edited since its posting. Latest edit was made on 21 Oct 2008 @ 5:19

2321.10.2008 8:13

Azuran, you are correct. He is a greedy but not a moron. His successors are both.

I have my updates turned off for over a year. I figure M$ is a more realistic threat than hackers. The updates left the OS hostile to older software including M$ software. The hostile update could not be backed out. M$ wants to annoy you into buying new software. It just forced me into Open Office.
Once they screw up your software they will not help you. You are put on infinite hold. I know someone that stayed on hold for 8 hrs. His company of 100 persons had a M$ business mail account and they ‘lost’ all the mailboxes. M$ claimed they would be happy to restore the boxes. The guy hung up after 8 hrs. They have gmail now.

2421.10.2008 13:57
fgamer
Inactive

I'm so tired of hearing haters say Microsoft is a bunch of greedy morons. I guarantee you the same ones saying that crap are typing it from a computer running either Vista or XP. Fact of the matter is, Microsoft is doing what any other company would do. They obviously strive to be the best so why does that make them bad? Sure some of their ways of handling things are a little rough and could use some revision, but it could be worse (really).

I'm just not receptive to all the Microsoft hate, because most of it stems from them being number one and making millions upon millions of $$. Face the fact that China is pirating all of Microsoft's stuff like it aint no tommorow, and I mean HEAVILY pirating. Now half of you in here know damn well if you owned Microsoft you'd be anti-pirates too, I know I would! It's no different than someone sharing your work that you put time and money into only to see it pirated.

This message has been edited since its posting. Latest edit was made on 21 Oct 2008 @ 14:02

2521.10.2008 15:49

Not surprising really.

Deviants are the first to complain when their deviant principles clash with the norm. Other criminals are also unhappy that their sins are unacceptable to the majority.

The line about opting in was especially funny. Thieves can choose not to steal. It's a lifestyle choice.

2621.10.2008 16:38

Yes not surprising at all.

then again you have those that think there so perfect there ass need be wiped by golden toilet paper.

Thieves are made by one of two things the need to survive, or the need to profit.Ironically those two types of thieves despise Each others methods, although they both do the same thing in the end steal.

a thief is a title for something we do not understand,nor care to after all we know thief's all steal and thats good enough for you right.

2721.10.2008 16:51

Originally posted by fgamer:
I'm so tired of hearing haters say Microsoft is a bunch of greedy morons. I guarantee you the same ones saying that crap are typing it from a computer running either Vista or XP. Fact of the matter is, Microsoft is doing what any other company would do. They obviously strive to be the best so why does that make them bad? Sure some of their ways of handling things are a little rough and could use some revision, but it could be worse (really).

I'm just not receptive to all the Microsoft hate, because most of it stems from them being number one and making millions upon millions of $$. Face the fact that China is pirating all of Microsoft's stuff like it aint no tommorow, and I mean HEAVILY pirating. Now half of you in here know damn well if you owned Microsoft you'd be anti-pirates too, I know I would! It's no different than someone sharing your work that you put time and money into only to see it pirated.
I totally agree with your comments. You can sure tell the sensible apart from the warped.
I don't like or use Explorer, Office and some of the other products Microsoft produces, but I don't agree with the warped who think that stealing is justified for some reasons.

When we allow the warped to convince us that stealing is justified for some peoples' reasons, it won't be long before the world becomes decadent.
Allowing the warped to silence you is another lifestyle choice.
This message has been edited since its posting. Latest edit was made on 21 Oct 2008 @ 16:59

Incremental Liberalism is change without informed consent.

2821.10.2008 20:00

Quote:
I totally agree with your comments. You can sure tell the sensible apart from the warped.
I don't like or use Explorer, Office and some of the other products Microsoft produces, but I don't agree with the warped who think that stealing is justified for some reasons.

When we allow the warped to convince us that stealing is justified for some peoples' reasons, it won't be long before the world becomes decadent.
Allowing the warped to silence you is another lifestyle choice.
Now thats ironic Isn't it, considering the only warped ones are those that inflate there prices above the masses reach.

The sooner you realize the world revolves around the Warped the better. You can be the meanest, greediest, richest SOB out there, and you will always be missing something,always.

2922.10.2008 0:45

I've never paid for anything that Microsoft ever come out with, and I never will, lol! Thats it XP is Activated, Genuine and you can update forever.
Yippeeeeeee!!!!

3022.10.2008 1:20
varnull
Inactive

I don't use Microsoft software at all.. none of it. My OS and applications are all 100% free and legal.

Debian GNU/Linux 4.0 2.6.18-6-k7

So don't go making assumptions about who steals what or it will bite you in the a$$ ;)

M$ are stalinist.. they want monopoly by exclusion. People need to wise up and show them the door with their lock-in monopolistic tendencies and anti-competitive behaviour before we all lose.

See the Novell-suse-M$ fiasco if you want proof of how this over large corporation really works, and the lies and half truths they use to bamboozle people.

3122.10.2008 11:56

I am a hater! Why do you believe haters have to be stealers? If I steal anything I don't think you have the right to complain.

Why do I complain? Am I a jackass, probably yes?

However, this is my view. This century M$ has replaced sold working products with unstable products. I think this is very irresponsible.

What really gets me is they have made changes to my computer that annoy me many times a day for really no compelling reason. I have an old computer with older software. I am happy with the way things are but M$ is not. So they annoy me all the time on my own computer and until I upgrade to a better OS. For sure I will never buy another M$ product unless they actually produce something worth buying and stop spamming me on my own computer.

I have been using hotmail ever since it opened. I actually paid to have more space I had 8 years of important mail there because I assumed it was safe. A few years back they offered me to switch to the nice new look with the butterfly. I resisted because I hate how the butter fly looked. I expected trouble. Then they forced me to switch like it or not. Within a week my email account was blown away. I spent weeks trying to get it restored. The tech support claimed I must have blown away my account. I told them they were full out sh1t! That is like claiming you ate yourself. Later I learned they had actually blown away thousands of accounts and not even business accounts were restored because the new system does not back up. This means my problem was no surprise. A friend worked for a company with a 100 box account with them with a paid for tech support agreement. They just put him on hold for 8 hrs till he hung up.

After one update my right clicks and double click functions did not work anymore. They asked me to reinstall the software. I did but that did not help. I suspect although my software is legal it is real old. They are hoping that if they annoy me many times a day maybe I will buy new versions their BS software. Instead it just hardens my heart! I am forced to use the newer software at work. The manager in charge is software developement should be put on a spit and slowly roasted over a fire! They radically changed the interface. Things I use are harder to get to, so that stuff I have never used in 10 years is more accessible. When I can’t figure out how to do something I used to be able to do I go to the help menu. In one case it said go to such and such menu and select the item. It was not there. I figure if you switch everything around at least get the help menu right.

Maybe all you lovers think I should worship them. Probably you get you paycheck from them.

This I where I come from. The customer is always right even though they contradict themselves in the same statement. 3 years back we were told to modify an app the day before it went out. We complained our methodology requires 30 days of testing if we make a change. We were told do it anyway. 6 month later we were in a ‘barking dog meeting’ where we were screamed at for being so incompetent. We were told if we were that incompetent again they would have to replace us with proven winners. The actual problem was in 3 out of over 100,000 reports submitted to us the interaction between several of the 1,000+ data elements on the report was not tabulated correctly. Something that small could not have been found in 3 month. Oh, and the barking dog has the very same person that told us to ignore the rules. We come in on the weekend to insure things get done on time even if all the problems that slowed us down were not our fault.

We are held to perfection regardless of all factors.
You can’t imagine the level of loathing I have for these cretins that opt to do complete rewrites of systems that work well then test them half-assed before they were released to the public. They should never have re-written the thing in the first place. If you do overhaul, make sure it works as well as the one it replaces. Is that too much too much to ask?

No, I do not worship them. I despise (HATE) them.

3222.10.2008 12:14

lol

3322.10.2008 14:39

Same here..Yahoo mail isnt really all that different than Hotmail. If you dont use the account for more than a year, trust me..they will delete the account after a few warnings to save server space. Nothing is "safe", especially where corporations are concerned. Any data you want to keep..better to just burn it to dvd or blu-ray rather than keep it stored on server (i.e hard drives...which if dropped, are BROKEN for good).

3423.10.2008 1:25

Originally posted by varnull:
I think they have... but that's not so much M$ as it is the game publishers. Think about it from M$ perspective.. you go pirate a game and then pay $xxx dollars a year for the live account to play it online.. That doesn't hurt M$ at all.. It probably costs them a fair chunk to implement systems to detect non-original media.. and to have at least 1 staff to run the ban process every month.. looks to me like 1 person anyway by the long gaps between ban outings.

Open Source numbers continue to rise.. fista is the best thing that ever happened for linux/bsd. In fact IMHO it's only an idiot who buys M$ software these days to be called a thief and a pirate every 30 minutes.
I install stolen XP all the time.. wpa and wga cracks, disable the auto updates (by messing up the url's it hunts for.. hex editor and skillz needed) and away they go for months and months of hassle free XP using.. poor n00bs. I feel real bad perpetuating the sheeple drone M$ users by helping them... but honestly.. they are too programmed and thick to use anything else (even though windows is hard to use, old fashioned and clunky)
Re-education is required.. in a big way... Starting in schools.. we must make it clear that using proprietary software in so called "IT" courses is rubbish. Kids only know how to use M$ software.. and then go looking for employment in places that use unix/linux/solaris... and they don't have a clue without that sodding paper clip telling them what to do every 10 seconds.
I know I know.. school isn't to educate.. it's to program the next generation of non thinking consumers.. but really.......

Dude... There is a reason Windows is so popular... It's the halfway point between Mac and Linux/Unix. It's less babied than Mac but less demanding compared to Linux. I decided to give Linux a try so I installed Ubuntu. Then spent the next couple hours on the net trying to figure out how to install programs... Hell with that. I can do more on Windows. Yes Ubuntu has a software depository that you can just click to get, but all the stuff in there was minumum 6 months old. Too old considering some software was onto a complete new version... Linux has to become more user friendly to be installed in a companies work stations.

And yes kids only know how to use Ms software. Reason being that it is the predominant business software out there. Ms provides tech support and prices its software accordingly. And to not install updates at all is just stupid. Ever heard of Metasploit? Free program. It's a hacking platform. Load a vulnerability and exploit in it then hit a target. Easy as to use. What about Milworm? It's a site that has exploits. The Ms updates are their for a reason. Most major viruses attack old vulnerabilities. Not 0day exploits, holes that have been known about for 6 months or more... I don't install Ms updates right away as they have a bad habit of not working properly straight away. But leaving it more than a month is idiotic.

And you know what Vistas problem was? It's secure... Those boxes that popup which everyone hates really do stop most viruses and worms. Because nothing gets changed without the user knowing about it. But it's waaay too annoying so it gets disabled. Smart... Another problem was that it won't run on old comps. You can install Linux on a wristwatch so you should be able to install Windows! Not quite... Maybe some of us like to run software not dating back to the Windows 95 days... Or play games more recent than Doom or Quake III... Linux still has dodgy as graphics support. Driver support in general actually...

I don't even like Ms but that comment was just too dodgy. Now I'm off to install FreeBSD with a book larger than my Uni textbooks... Some of us have the spare time needed to waste learning indepth programming and OS facts but not all of us... Remember that the next time you bag out Ms users for not using Linux. Which is just a Unix ripoff anyway..


A minor addon, a major complaint here is that Ms sells unstable and virus prone products. That's not entirely true... They do seem to be particulary vulnerable to buffer overflows but overall they aren't that bad. The reason viruses continually target Windows and Ms products isn't because they're easier to hit than Mac or Linux, it's because everyone uses them. Why spend months crafting the perfect virus for Ubuntu? The return on that will be small enough to be dismissable. You won't get financial data, backdoors in servers, mass hysteria etc. As soon as people start using a different OS then that OS will be the one hit with enough viruses to kill it just like Windows. Apply some thought here peoples... Do try to think through things before making stupid statements.
This message has been edited since its posting. Latest edit was made on 23 Oct 2008 @ 1:31

3523.10.2008 10:12

Windsong, no you do not understand my complaints about hotmail. Although I am a hot head, I think I give software developers a fair amount of slack. Yahoo is a fine stable application. I would not complain if my account was blown away if it was free and I had not used it in 6 months. My paid for hotmail account that still had over 6 month of contracted time, was blown away twice in two months, once while I was in it. That was not a software problem but a hardware problem. The software problems in hotmail are constant. I am sure it has to do with the core functions in the libraries they used. I have NEVER used the ‘new’ hotmail without some kind of minor problem. I use it several hrs each day. Sometimes you can’t edit a forwarded message unless you switch from the default editing to plain text. Sometimes the buttons disappear, sometimes the scroll bars disappear. Today’s problem for me is the windows for the message and contact list have resized themselves to tiny with no way to resize them. However, when I went it to see what the contact list was named the windows are now the correct size. The bugs vary from hour to hour. I have no idea what this hr’s bug is. Oh and for chrissd and anyone else I have these problems with up-to-date everything at work. So it is not caused by my updates are turned off at home.

chrissd, I can only agree some with a few of your statements the rest are pretty much 'out there'. Again you sound as if you get a paycheck in some way related to M$. I remember this kind of irrational support for the Mac from a member. Later, it came out that person was a salesman for Mac. Everyone writes viruses for M$ because that is the most common OS. Would waste their time writing a virus for another OS?

Maybe you feel persons without the most up-to-date software should be treated like DOGs? Do you feel that way about everything else? Do you always drive the latest model car? You buy a new house every year? I am sure you must have something you don’t want to throw away every year.

A large portion of my soft ware library is Win 95 or earlier. I spent a few grand to buy the stuff over years and I do not have the money to replace them all. I have more than 1 computer. All with legal software. The kid's computer is all XP vintage and they experiance no problems. I guess you figure that is my problem and that I should have no rights because I am not current. My huge beef with M$ is not that my old dog eared software does not work. It is why it does not work. Years after XP was released, a certain upgrade created problems. I am certain it was a conscious effort for force upgrades. They hoped if the users were annoyed often enough they might buy all new software.

CHRISSD TELL ME HOW SABOTAGING MY SOFTWARE TO COMPELL ME TO BUY NEW SOFTWARE IS IN THE LEAST BIT ETHICAL? IF YOU CAN EXPLAIN THAT ONE AWAY YOU OUGHT TO BE IN POLITICS!

3624.10.2008 4:56

Good on Microsoft. Millons of chinese not using the genuine article have been thumbing their noses at the USA for years. They're even accusing Microsoft of hacking their system with WGA! lol

3726.10.2008 20:25

Good Lord Mez...if you can't understand why your Old software doesn't work with the new MS OS's, then you are beyond help friend. It also wasn't an update that changed things either...maybe you should look elsewhere.
Please don't equate old cars to computers either, they simply cannot be used in comparison for many obvious reasons, unless they start changing the structure of gasoline every 3 years or so...
Computer technology changes at too fast a rate for older s'ware to be used forever, even tho you may want it to last that long it simply isn't possible. If you want to run w95 s'ware then stick with w95 OS but don't complain because your 14 year old s'ware doesn't run on XP or Vista. The OS has evolved and your s'ware library has not and in an effort to limit vulnerabilities MS has finally stopped trying to be backwards compatible with Legacy products.
The new OS is far more secure because of this shift in tactics by MS and for many of us this was long overdue because trying to maintain backwards compatibility simply carried over exploit vulnerabilities from OS to OS. Buffer Overflow exploits have been eliminated now because of this change as have many others as well, so maybe it's time you get with the (new) program(s). Otherwise, stick with W95/98 and stop complaining simply because the techno world moves forward while you stay stuck in the DOS world.

3827.10.2008 10:11

Good Lord, ChappyTTV try reading the post more carefully and think before post your comment to the world. I do know why it does not work, it was sabotaged. I stated that clearly enough. The software did not stop functioning because of an I/O improvement that might improve performance somewhere in the system. It was sabotaged long after any real improvements had been added. It wasn't even sabotaged well because it still works fine depending on how you get into it. However, that is not my issue. My issue is I believe it is unethical to use OS updates to sabotage software. Can I guess that you think this is OK? Do you believe anyone that doesn’t keep current should be punished?

Quote:
It also wasn't an update that changed things either...maybe you should look elsewhere.


If that statement isn’t condescending I don’t know what is. You were not there when it happened. I do not think you know what the OS was nor what version the software of the app is nor what the perceived problems in the app are nor which update was made but you believe you know more about the problem than I do. So unless you think you are an omnipotent being that would be a totally senseless thing to say.

My guess is you obviously greatly over estimate your technical prowess you appear clueless as to what real changes were made when. Please prove me wrong, I like to learn. Maybe you do know something useful I don't know. TELL ME WHAT HAPPENED. Tell me what REALLY happened to my software and why it doesn’t work, the more technical the explanation, the better. I don't mind apologizing if I discover you are not a COMPLETE buffoon.

391.11.2008 22:32

Reason for edit - no use replying, some things will never change and "opinions" are a prime example.

This message has been edited since its posting. Latest edit was made on 01 Nov 2008 @ 22:36

402.11.2008 9:49

ChappyTTV, we can agree with that. Opinions are hard to change.

Sorry I went off. I am a computer programmer and although I have not seen the code, I have an extremely good idea what happened. I believe a decision was made by management to annoy persons that had very old software. Programmers would have spotted the problem and the manager said do not worry about it. This happens a great deal.

You sooooo rubbed me the wrong way that you would discount what I thought and tell me I didn't understand without any information on your end. Your hubris and ignorance reminded me of a software manager. The biggest complaints of programmers are that we are now all under the control of ‘use car salesmen’. They are more slippery than greased Teflon pig and tell you to do stupid things that blame the programmer. Not all software managers are like this but most of the work for small companies where the owner care more about results than BJs.

This message has been edited since its posting. Latest edit was made on 02 Nov 2008 @ 9:55

413.11.2008 7:52

The specifications of XP stated that it would run my software without problems. I believe software ought to do what it states it can do. Obviously you think differently as long as you don’t mind the discrepancies. If you don’t mind no one else should either. You stating that that doesn’t matter without any reasoning behind your statement doesn’t make me believe you.

I have made my opinion over decade from hundreds of observations. You just telling me my opinion is wrong without any reasoning doesn’t cut it with me. That will not cut it with many members. I do not tell you are wrong because you waste your money upgrading software that has no usable improvements. Do not tell me I am wrong just because I expect the software to do what it is supposed to do.

If you maintain the attitude that you are right and everyone that disagrees with you is wrong will produce a good deal of conflict.

You’re parting comment

Quote:
no use replying, some things will never change and "opinions" are a prime example.

suggests to me the exact blaring arrogance of your first post. My opinion is only an "opinion", real nice! Your opinion is the only right opinion, even though it is groundless. The facts are insignificant compared with how you feel.

You might want to think through why you think someone is wrong before you state they are wrong. If you don't expect lively commentary.

424.11.2008 0:00

American Citizens Angry at Lack of Toilet paper in Public Restrooms

According to a report from WeDontdoshat.Org, American citizens are upset over the lack of toilet paper.

Who's to blame for this crisis,One American had this to say

"Man im telling you its those freakin near dead custodians, ya cant get rid of im fire 1, 4 more show up to take his place."


We stoped and shook hands and asked a man as he was coming out out the restroom about the crisis at hand here's what he said.

"WTF else is new. i usually just use a pamphlet they got lying around, hell its either that or your hand these days"


well there you have it folks a real American crisis.

434.11.2008 6:28

DXR88, I think your post is strangely appropriate.

444.11.2008 10:09

Originally posted by Mez:
DXR88, I think your post is strangely appropriate.
Ya think :).

456.11.2008 14:18

No doubt China will develop their own version of MSFT and take over the world with it -- or perhaps just buy MSFT. We've got to think in the big scheme of things. The tides are against MSFT in the USA.

4617.11.2008 8:53

Originally posted by Mez:
Oh and for chrissd and anyone else I have these problems with up-to-date everything at work. So it is not caused by my updates are turned off at home.

chrissd, I can only agree some with a few of your statements the rest are pretty much 'out there'. Again you sound as if you get a paycheck in some way related to M$. I remember this kind of irrational support for the Mac from a member. Later, it came out that person was a salesman for Mac. Everyone writes viruses for M$ because that is the most common OS. Would waste their time writing a virus for another OS?

Maybe you feel persons without the most up-to-date software should be treated like DOGs? Do you feel that way about everything else? Do you always drive the latest model car? You buy a new house every year? I am sure you must have something you don’t want to throw away every year.

A large portion of my soft ware library is Win 95 or earlier. I spent a few grand to buy the stuff over years and I do not have the money to replace them all. I have more than 1 computer. All with legal software. The kid's computer is all XP vintage and they experiance no problems. I guess you figure that is my problem and that I should have no rights because I am not current. My huge beef with M$ is not that my old dog eared software does not work. It is why it does not work. Years after XP was released, a certain upgrade created problems. I am certain it was a conscious effort for force upgrades. They hoped if the users were annoyed often enough they might buy all new software.

CHRISSD TELL ME HOW SABOTAGING MY SOFTWARE TO COMPELL ME TO BUY NEW SOFTWARE IS IN THE LEAST BIT ETHICAL? IF YOU CAN EXPLAIN THAT ONE AWAY YOU OUGHT TO BE IN POLITICS!
HAHAHAHAHAHAHA. Well, you made my day :P

I'm a 20 year old student studying Computer Security so I do actually know what I'm talking about. It isn't entirely ranting from a M$ rep. Now.. Windows 95 software nowadays is not guaranteed to run on anything.. Yes Win XP includes a lot of old DOS files so it will run most DOS, Win 95 programs but not all. Upgrades for Win XP include better support for new programs, and by doing so some support for older software is removed because of incompatibilities.

Now, if M$ ignored the newer software to keep old software working they would have been out of business a long, long time ago. If all your software is Win 95 or older then you realllllllly need to update. Hell, I'm betting you'd be vulnerable to an old 90's virus. Give me your IP and I can check :P

But being serious, upgrade. Yes Microsoft software is expensive but it works. Well, it works unless some idiot has decided to pretend they're cool and make a 10 line piece of code that formats ppls harddrives and works through a whole in Office.. But apart from that..

Also, Win 95 software was made for Win 95. Run a copy of that if you want to use your software. Car manufacturers stop making parts for cars 5 versions later, why not M$?

Now I'm off to buy my new house with my latest model car.. :P
Well, more like a virtual version of it but I can still pretend, right?

4717.11.2008 10:16

chrissd, being a programmer I am sure the bug was on purpose. I am sure the programmers warned management of the ramifications and management said 'f%ckem'. I am really not sure if the apps were 95 I think they were 98. When XP came out it was stated it would run my software which it did for years.

Do not get me wrong, I do think the world would be a lesser place with out M$. However, everyone already got theirs. Even the programmers got stock options. M$ made more millionairs than any other corporation in history. I figure we do not owe them anything now.

I do love that they destroyed the IBM theroy that programmers must wear garter belts to be productive. Yes, garter belts! New employees were checked routinely until everyone was sure they came to work properly dressed. The pizza eating programmers at M$ wearing pizza stained T-shirts blew away the programmers in suits and ties at IBM.

However, I think they have been putting out true crap this century.

4817.11.2008 16:48

how can one compare Windows 9x series a simple strait forward running OS to that running a more complex management system Called NT.

CMD is an emulation of dos-ware program's. hell the NT kernel alone was never 100% with Dos programes.

(@Mez) if you need to run old dos programs give Dosbox a try.



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4917.11.2008 19:56

No these are office products circa Win 98. Microsoft changed the key algorythem. Key codes before XP were mostly numbers now they are letters. Even after installing re-installing them the right click functions do not work but the application works. The programmers know the old algorythem and could have checked it instead they have chosen to annoy me. They didn't kill the app they just fVcking with me because I have a too old for their liking application. I have gone to Live Office which works fine for me.

This message has been edited since its posting. Latest edit was made on 17 Nov 2008 @ 20:20

5017.11.2008 20:00

Open office is a fine piece of software, if your willing to try something free.


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5117.11.2008 20:29

That is what I am using I miss spoke saying I was using Live Office. I just want simple word processing. The fanciest I go is tables and inserted objects.

If I want to edit HTML I use a HTML editor not a word processor. I am stuck with the latest Office at work I really do not like to go through menus to do what I used to do without any menus. The older layout was great.

5217.11.2008 23:12

Ah. okay i thought thats what you meant. in any case goodday Mez


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5319.11.2008 7:53

Thanks DXR88.

I feel the need to explain my terrible aditude. In the good old days software managers were ex-programmers who had gotten too old to program. Now they are mostly used car salesmen. They tell you do do stupid things then try to get the programmers in trouble when it fails. This is a universal complaint in the programming community.

I can see the results in all the products. I can use software and can 'feel' if it is technicalloy sound or not. If it does not 'feel' right it is a good bet a slippery unethical moron was in charge. What you can see and feel is not the the real problem. There will be got-yous where you can't see.

5419.11.2008 22:21

Amen !


crackmeup

5519.11.2008 22:23

Amen !


crackmeup

5620.11.2008 8:00

revengine, are you a developer or just notice how even well established software has gone down hill in the last few years.

5720.11.2008 17:45

Well I like java, and yes I've also noticed how some well established software has gone down hill. Sales people will tell you anything to make a sale, lol.


crackmeup

5824.11.2008 12:12

revengine, that is the point! Quality of the product doesn't matter to most software companies any more; they figure that will just sell harder. Most of the excellent softare that had not gone down hill are created by one man shows where the developer runs the show. This is a generality and is not always the case. There are some large companies that actually put something of value in their upgrades but they are the minority.

This message has been edited since its posting. Latest edit was made on 25 Nov 2008 @ 7:07

5925.11.2008 0:14

Enjoyed this thread; peace out, rev


crackmeup

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