Good point with the cell phone plan, I hadn't even considered that. So they will have to sign a 4 year (at least) contract at minimum $70 a month. Those 48 months plus the phone will cost almost $4000 total, so that requirement isn't looking so innocent anymore. That price is how much a semester cost me in my undergrad.

This doesn't even account for costs that might be incurred when having to cancel a contract early, or pay for two at the same time. Everyone should know how difficult it is dealing with cell phone companies and their contracts. You have to sacrifice an arm to get out of a contract early, and it won't be cheap. I would bet most people get cornered into this problem from this requirement, of either having to cancel their current plan or carry two plans until the old one expires.

This also doesn't account for how much less most students would spend with a different cell phone. I know for undergrad my parents payed my cell phone bill, and it was only $20 a month. That was the fee to simply add my phone onto their plan. Now these kids don't get this kind of deal, they or their parents are stuck getting the only carrier and getting the only plan offered for the iphone. Talk about monopoly, this requirement is basically forcing people into a cell phone carrier and plan despite what may be best for that particular person.

This seems like a ridiculous waste of money for students. Especially when the only justification for this requirement is that lectures are bad learning models and need to be repeated for content to be absorbed. Maybe then a change in teaching method would be preferable to passing this cost on to students. I completed two bachelors degrees and a masters degree, and I have to admit, in all my years of school, I never met a student who willingly listened to a lecture twice.

In addition, has it occurred to the administrators in question here that this is a school of journalism? That lectures repeated via iTunes app will be seriously compromising the important skill of notetaking and retaining what you hear the first time around? This school is basically training a whole generation of the worst reporters ever. "Pardon me President Obama, but could you repeat what you just said? It didn't quite sink in the first time..."

Originally posted by MsCarrie:

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This seems like a ridiculous waste of money for students. Especially when the only justification for this requirement is that lectures are bad learning models and need to be repeated for content to be absorbed.

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Actually, many studies show that when something is repeated a couple of days after the lesson, the resultes are much better than hearing the lesson only once.

1. It IS helpful to be able to hear a lecture twice, especially when the information is complex, the instructor has an accent or is a poor speaker, the student is stressed, etc, etc..
2. The phone service is not required if you get a Touch
3. This policy is mostly related to qualifying for financial aid. It's up to the students to get the devices and/or use the devices, Apple or something else.
4. The cost of college, loans or paying in cash, is the best investment of money and time available when compared to the increased income over high school only. Way better than that new car or the weekly night on the town.

Article has a fundamental flaw...

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Brooks did note however that theoretically any MP3 player could be used. "You could use a Zune, for example," he noted.

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Where does that make an iphone (useless fone.. overpriced plans.. crap by any way you look at it) compulsory?? Like.. IT DOESN'T !!! and I think they would find themselves getting sued by people who don't want to buy apple products and phone plans with the one and only supplier.. that's the core issue with anti-trust.


When I went to uni.. in that dim and distant past.. you TOOK LECTURE NOTES while you were in attendance.. recording a lecture would get you thrown out .. how times have changed in this generation where writing seems to be a lost art.

financial aid is not a loan for one, and the cost of the phone plan would not add up to 70 a month.

college students already have phone plans, so at most this will be 20-40 dollars more a month than their current plans.

also, you dont have to buy an iphone, you can just claim the financial aid which is why they required an iphone, and then buy a 15 dollar mp3 player, just as the article states. The only reason it is required is to get the benefit from the financial aid.

If you can afford school you can afford an iPhone

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Article has a fundamental flaw...

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Brooks did note however that theoretically any MP3 player could be used. "You could use a Zune, for example," he noted.

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Where does that make an iphone (useless fone.. overpriced plans.. crap by any way you look at it) compulsory?? Like.. IT DOESN'T !!! and I think they would find themselves getting sued by people who don't want to buy apple products and phone plans with the one and only supplier.. that's the core issue with anti-trust.

When I went to uni.. in that dim and distant past.. you TOOK LECTURE NOTES while you were in attendance.. recording a lecture would get you thrown out .. how times have changed in this generation where writing seems to be a lost art.

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I think you have misunderstood the article - the IPhone is compulsory - the associate is stating that "theoretically" another device could be used but they are not adding those devices to the list - it is the Iphone they have made compulsory - explaining what could be done in theory but not in practice does not make this article flawed. - he doesn't mean theoretically in terms of the course requirements he means theoretically in terms of practical possibility on this planet.

HOW TO GO TO COLLEGE FOR CHEAP

1. Get the iPod or Zune (which really I bet apple is behing this somehow)

2. Buy an Amazon Kindle (or Sony Reader)

3. Torrent your text books.

LOL

It's worked for me thus far. My books would have come out to like 400 alone. Ugh

;-)

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Originally posted by masa92:

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Going to college there in the States is expensive enough, so only those who are really rich can afford that luxury for their kids... What do you think another 500 bucks will do for them?

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I have to agree that you are extremely ignorant. I just graduated debt free from a private school out of state without any help from parents. So did my wife. Neither of us come from wealthy families. ANYBODY that is willing to work hard can get a good education from the best universities in the world.

-Richard

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REALLY? I have to question that, since the Federal Pell Grant limit on income was $16,500 last time I checked. So that means someone like my fiance, who made $18,000 for the year (BEFORE TAX) should be able to afford $4000 a semester for school?

Let's also consider the other intangible factors. Let's take 30% off that $18,000 to account for Federal and State income tax, medicare, social security, etc. We now stand at $12,600.

Of course, you need a place to live, hopefully not by yourself. If you are lucky to live at home with the parents, great, but you're not out of the wood yet, unless you have reliable transportation that is paid for. Also, said car must be insured in my state of residence, and full coverage runs around $500-600 (6 months) for a college age student. That drops you another 10% of your post-tax income, not including rent, utilities, and even fuel for said car.

If you see where I'm getting at, full-timers at McDonald's would have a difficult time paying for school DEBT FREE. I haven't even scratched the surface of feeding yourself or additional costs such as textbooks, parking or classroom fees that may not be covered by grants. (I am picking on grants, because loans of course must be paid back eventually.) Of course, I picked a low-end semester cost. Paying for the FINEST institutions in the world? It's not in the equation!

Now, Missouri students are required to add a several hundred dollar iPod to their expenses? And how ridiculous is it to add that $70 a month iPhone plan to what could be a shoestring budget? Awesome job faculty! Let's send more educated persons to the poorhouse before they secure a job that could pay the bills, not to mention they must compete with jobless millions that may already have years of invaluable work experience!

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Ok, let me tell you how I did it. I didn't own a car for the first couple years (I lived in Venezuela for two years, where graduate education is free, I can tell you most of them don't own cars). I lived with 5 other roomates and had rent of about $200/month. I never ate out. I didn't own a cell phone. I split the phone bill with my roommates. I worked 20 hours per week during the school year and more during the summer. I couldn't get a pell grant my first few years because my parents made "too much". I did get it once I got married. I must admit I did get scholarships that helped pay for my tuition, but those were available to people based on scholarly aptitude, NOT the wealth of parents.

If you want to get through school debt free, you can't expect to live like a King. You decided it was worth it to get the loans and maintain that standard of living. I decided it wasn't. It's all about priorities. Honestly, if teachers started publishing their books in a digital format, the cost of books could pay off the ipod touch they need to buy.

I would certainly just purchase a good/cheap MP3 player. You know what will happen to many of those IPods? battery replacement (pain in the A**). Falls in the "bowl" or whatever, lost. I have an inexpensive player, however, I use a $30 one that's great (uses SD cards which makes it so flexible).
Think about this. You can convert the words to TEXT. Now you can search all the lectures or cut and paste. That's an easy way to "take" notes. Now you know what to ask the prof about anything you didn't understand or what he could make clear. Or you can sue him/her ..a student is doing so as I type this.

Prof can use the recordings to catch whatever he missed or needs to enhance from his own notes.

If your older brother/sister went to the same school, you might have the lectures even before you go to class since a lot of lecturers teach the same old dribble year after year after.... Perhaps, this might challenge him to grow a little in his own knowledge.

Wow, the Academic Dean can review any or all lectures. Instructors, better do a good job in preparing if you want to get your contract renewed.
Perhaps, higher education will now produce a better product.

torrenting textbooks might work for your intro level general education classes like psych. or geography. But I was a music performance major, and I doubt there is a torrent floating around of the New Grove music dictionary or the Norton Anthology of Music. These are probably the two most universal books in the field and I would almost guarantee there isn't a digital copy available.


My books were so expensive my first few years. I was spending $300+ a semester, but fortunately my parents were helping me out then. Then I wisened up and realized I either could share a book with someone, buy it cheap offline and then resell, or just completely go without the book. I just finished a masters degree only buying one textbook, and I immediately resold it almost at face value.

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Ok, let me tell you how I did it. I didn't own a car for the first couple years (I lived in Venezuela for two years, where graduate education is free, I can tell you most of them don't own cars). I lived with 5 other roomates and had rent of about $200/month. I never ate out. I didn't own a cell phone. I split the phone bill with my roommates. I worked 20 hours per week during the school year and more during the summer. I couldn't get a pell grant my first few years because my parents made "too much". I did get it once I got married. I must admit I did get scholarships that helped pay for my tuition, but those were available to people based on scholarly aptitude, NOT the wealth of parents.

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Welcome to the land of opportunities... But for real, who wants to live that kind of life, just to get an education... i wouldn't. Where I live, we have this communist system, so the states pays me if I go to college or univeristy. Also they pay me if I live in my own house. Isn't it just crazy: they waste money on me more than 1000$ a month... Just so that we all, equally, can get eduvations and carrer.

My point is that if you can afford college, you should be able to buy an itouch/iphone.

Originally posted by amf0802:

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torrenting textbooks might work for your intro level general education classes like psych. or geography. But I was a music performance major, and I doubt there is a torrent floating around of the New Grove music dictionary or the Norton Anthology of Music. These are probably the two most universal books in the field and I would almost guarantee there isn't a digital copy available.


My books were so expensive my first few years. I was spending $300+ a semester, but fortunately my parents were helping me out then. Then I wisened up and realized I either could share a book with someone, buy it cheap offline and then resell, or just completely go without the book. I just finished a masters degree only buying one textbook, and I immediately resold it almost at face value.

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Well, that works out fine until you have a "workbook" that is required, where you rip out pages for quizzes or assignments, rendering it useless as a resale or trade-in. There was also an increasing trend at my university where professors where getting together, and authoring the required book for a class, which meant they were pocketing extra money.

I usually bought and sold my books on Half.com, but this was just as digital copies were starting to appear. This was after a week or so of the class, so I could figure out if 1) I really needed the book in the first place (some teachers just lecture and lecture and...) and 2) whether I would drop the class and be stuck with an expensive book!

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Ok, let me tell you how I did it. I didn't own a car for the first couple years (I lived in Venezuela for two years, where graduate education is free, I can tell you most of them don't own cars). I lived with 5 other roomates and had rent of about $200/month. I never ate out. I didn't own a cell phone. I split the phone bill with my roommates. I worked 20 hours per week during the school year and more during the summer. I couldn't get a pell grant my first few years because my parents made "too much". I did get it once I got married. I must admit I did get scholarships that helped pay for my tuition, but those were available to people based on scholarly aptitude, NOT the wealth of parents.

If you want to get through school debt free, you can't expect to live like a King. You decided it was worth it to get the loans and maintain that standard of living. I decided it wasn't. It's all about priorities. Honestly, if teachers started publishing their books in a digital format, the cost of books could pay off the ipod touch they need to buy.

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Kudos to you, that is awesome. Much of what you say is true, but my example was my fiance, who never finished her 4 year degree and is in the hole paying loans to this day. College sets you up for debt, but the truth is, many employers want that shiny piece of paper before they hire you. I have friends that are much further off becoming laborers for 5 years (that general amount of time a 4 year degree takes) and they had paid off cars, money in the bank, etc. and still sucessful. To say that a college education guarantees anything is ludicrious, especially in today's job market. I'm not against earning a degree, but if you go the loan route, you are setting yourself up for financial disaster before you even start to build a family, buy a house, etc.

And for my own personal experience, I was able to get a Pell Grant because I had a single parent and worked under the table. I was non-minority and that would've hurt my chances, even with a part time burger flipping job. The grant itself still was not enough to cover the entire semester cost, in addition to parking, lab fees, books, etc.

Geeze, there's a lot to talk about here so where should I start? I guess I'll start with what this article was about.

1. By adding the requirement of the ipod touch, the school can raise it's cost of attendance figure, so more people applying for financial aid will have a higher chance of receiving some aid. Here's an example of the way they come up with the cost of attendance. http://www.utsa.edu/FinancialAid/cost.html So you can see, now they can add $800 a year for the ipod touch.

2. That one guy who said anyone can go to college and receive the unsubsidized stafford loans is right. You can do that. People complain about how expensive college is and how they have no money saved to go right now, well those loans do give you the option of going right now.

3. Loans though, are not a free ride. I'm just going to a standard public university. I'm 24 now so I don't have to list my parents income when I apply for financial aid. I basically had an income of $0 last year, and yet the financial aid I received this year still requires me to pay about $800 per semester after the grants. That's for tuition. There's still books and living expenses. Luckily I've got a pretty lady that lives with me and works, and I've got my parents for backup, but for others I could see how they'd have to go with loans. I figured if I was going the loan route I could easily rack up $20k I'd need to pay back by the time I'd graduate.

4. Work, how the hell are you supposed to work when you're doing 15 credit hours of classes? You gotta spend at least 2 hours per 1 hours in class studying. 15 hours a week in class, 30 hours a week studying. That's already 45 hours a week spent on school, then work on top of that? I could see maybe working 15 hours a week, but 15 hours a week making near minimum wage. I think you'd still wouldn't be making as much as you need, and would still need to do loans or get money from someone.

5. Hidden Fee's of School. Parking pass for a year, $80. Books for classes? Well smart and crafty people like myself and others in this thread found cheap ways to get books, but most people probably go straight to the school's bookstore and pay fullprice for new books, or almost full price for the used books. Five classes a semester means five books, and they start at $100 each, but usually seem closer to $150.

6. Cheap books. I usually buy my books used on Amazon, and then at the end of the semester I sell them. Most of the time I sell them for about the same I paid for them. After the Amazon fee's I come out losing about $10, so basically it's like I rented the book for the semester for $10. Sometimes though I get screwed hard. How? New editions come out in the middle of the semester, and by the time the current semester is over and I no longer need the book it's lost most of it's value. So sometimes I buy the book for $80, and then end up selling it for $30 or $40. Other times, well the same thing happens, except the other way around. A book I need for a class is a new edition that just came out a few months ago, so there's not really any used copies available on Amazon. It's still a good $20 to $40 cheaper new on Amazon than at the book store, but the point is by the end of the semester when it's time to sell, there's lots of other people also selling their books, so you can end up losing $40 to $60 on it.

7. Free books. Yeah you can pirate books. I've done it before and it was more hassle than it was worth. At the school computer lab they usually give you some free printing. At the community college it was 15 free pages per day, at this university they give you 200 free pages per semester. Most of the time I just read them on my pc, but I get distracted easily and I'm sure most of you would too.

8. Old versions of books. Yeah for most classes that don't require you to solve problems out of the books. Basically everything but math classes, you can get the older editions. Go ahead and check the price of the older edition on Amazon right now. Yeah that's right, it should be under $10 for it.

9. Free rides through college. I guess it can happen, just you gotta keep on top of the deadlines for scholarship applications, and you gotta keep your grades up too. The hardest part for me is the dates. Schools do a crappy job advertising the scholarship information. I missed the deadline this year. For the 2009-2010 school year, the general scholarship application was due the last day of February 2009. I mean that's pretty damn early considering the semester doesn't start for another 6 months. Also wtf, there's no separate deadline for spring semester. I transfered in last spring so no scholarships then too. I guess my senior year I'll be able to see if I can get scholarships or not. I never bothered while in community college since it was so cheap to go there.

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so only those who are really rich can afford that luxury for their kids...

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You are a moron. College is cheap. If you go to an out-of-state public college or a private school, then yes, it is a rip off. But go to your state flagship university and it is cheap. Ever hear of something called financial aid? Even if you do not qualify for Pell Grants or subsidized Stafford loans, anyone automatically qualifies for unsubsidized Stafford loans.

My parents never paid a penny toward my college education. I went to undergrad, grad school, and law school. So stop your whining and do what I and most college grads did: get a loan.

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Wow, you're an edited by ddp. Cheers!

Some students on the cheap get the majority of their education at community colleges and then the difficult part at university. There is less stature that way, but a lot less $$ too. I smell a serious rat in this Apple product plug from this university. Someone is getting his/her pocket lined big time.

FYI: You can rent books for the entire semester for a fraction of the cost of buying them here:

https://www.chegg.com

Originally posted by dappy123:

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FYI: You can rent books for the entire semester for a fraction of the cost of buying them here:

https://www.chegg.com

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If you're fortunate enough, you can receive copies through the library system as well. I know that OhioNet is one such system for textbooks, but they go fast!

Originally posted by amf0802:

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torrenting textbooks might work for your intro level general education classes like psych. or geography. But I was a music performance major, and I doubt there is a torrent floating around of the New Grove music dictionary or the Norton Anthology of Music. These are probably the two most universal books in the field and I would almost guarantee there isn't a digital copy available.


My books were so expensive my first few years. I was spending $300+ a semester, but fortunately my parents were helping me out then. Then I wisened up and realized I either could share a book with someone, buy it cheap offline and then resell, or just completely go without the book. I just finished a masters degree only buying one textbook, and I immediately resold it almost at face value.

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edited by ddp

solsunftm, read the forum rules about linking to pirated materials. post edited.

Originally posted by amf0802:

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torrenting textbooks might work for your intro level general education classes like psych. or geography. But I was a music performance major, and I doubt there is a torrent floating around of the New Grove music dictionary or the Norton Anthology of Music. These are probably the two most universal books in the field and I would almost guarantee there isn't a digital copy available.


My books were so expensive my first few years. I was spending $300+ a semester, but fortunately my parents were helping me out then. Then I wisened up and realized I either could share a book with someone, buy it cheap offline and then resell, or just completely go without the book. I just finished a masters degree only buying one textbook, and I immediately resold it almost at face value.

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Just google the names of the books..

Took me like 4 seconds to find both of them in digital format

Lazy edited by ddp! Are students too lazy to friggin' write now, or what?

whatch the language. post edited.

By requiring it student may be able to get the loan amount enhanced but remember he /she still has to pay it back.

Why require someone to spend $500/= when a $200/= product will do equally well ? Someone needs to find out what kind of grant did Apple give to the university.

lol. I'd have to drop out of School. No way would i buy an Iphone if it became mandatory. Sorry i'd rather look like an idiot then a Douche Bag.