AfterDawn: Tech news

FBI arrest alleged 'Wolverine' workprint uploader

Written by Andre Yoskowitz (Google+) @ 16 Dec 2009 22:13 User comments (38)

FBI arrest alleged 'Wolverine' workprint uploader In April, one full month before its theatrical release, a workprint of the movie X-Men Origins: Wolverine
was uploaded to P2P and warez sites and promptly became one of the most downloaded pirated movies of the year.
This week, the FBI has arrested 47 year-old Gilberto Sanchez of the Bronx, NY (aka "theSkilled1" online) for uploading the film to MegaUpload.com and charged him with copyright infringement.

Sanchez now faces up to three years in prison as well as a $250,000 USD fine.

"We're supportive of the FBI's actions," noted Fox, the distributor of the film. "We will continue to cooperate with law enforcement officials to identify and prosecute those who illegally steal our creative content."

Perhaps more notably then the arrest is the fact that the indictment does not make it clear how Sanchez got the workprint in the first place, meaning it is possible that he was not the source of the leak.

Despite the rampant piracy, the movie went on to make over $300 million in the box office, and is the year's second best-selling Blu-ray behind Transformers 2.

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38 user comments

116.12.2009 22:58

I have to call Shenanigans on this one only for the facts that the leaked version was supposedly without special effects, The leaked version was reviewed by a fox employee and was fired for it, and to top it off the movie made a crap load of money. I'm wondering why the FBI even arrested the person to begin with makin it look like he's some high classed criminal when he clearly isn't that huge to be arrested by the FBI. I still say Fox had purposely leaked it to this day on this case. This is messed up I have to admit

217.12.2009 0:15

I'd have to agree. It would seam rather than appear impotent the FBI has taken a scapegoat.

317.12.2009 3:00

phew at least we can sleep soundly tonight knowing this criminal has been apprehended thanks FBI

417.12.2009 3:04

that is NOT the guy who got the workprint in his hands in the first place. how stupid

517.12.2009 5:06

How can they prove who has uploaded that movie to megaupload? I don't think megauploads shares the IPs that are being uses for uploading (actually, I doubt that they save more than the last IP for each user).

617.12.2009 5:25

This is just to make people afraid that the FB! (my ass) is in it.

717.12.2009 8:35

Quote:
How can they prove who has uploaded that movie to megaupload? I don't think megauploads shares the IPs that are being uses for uploading (actually, I doubt that they save more than the last IP for each user).

well im on dial up so my IP changes everytime i log on.i know broadband and cable is better but im in a remote part of australia so no broadband or cable is available here.

custom built gaming pc from early 2010,ps2 with 15 games all original,ps3 500gbs with 5 games all original,yamaha amp and 5.1channel surround sound speakers,46inch sony lcd smart tv.

817.12.2009 9:19

hasn't anyone notice that its the feds that have put up 30 million to fight the uploading of movies and this movie alone grossed over 300 million its only 10 persent of one movie s gross take, why havent the movie industry put up 50 persent of one years worth of gross of all movies that come out to fight the issue and they might make a dent , but they would rather have the tax payers of this country to flip the bill. its not a large issue to water mark the movies to figure out whatshow place is alowing the cams to run inside also making a blue screen instead of white screen movie would make it imposible for cams to record it I draw comics and we use blue pencels to outline or pages and it isnt able to be even photocopied so why havent they do this to movies? because they want to use the loss of sales as a tax write off lets get real and not stand for this 30 million would buy our troops armor they need in the wars they face from road side bombs..

917.12.2009 9:38

Quote:
Quote:
How can they prove who has uploaded that movie to megaupload? I don't think megauploads shares the IPs that are being uses for uploading (actually, I doubt that they save more than the last IP for each user).

well im on dial up so my IP changes everytime i log on.i know broadband and cable is better but im in a remote part of australia so no broadband or cable is available here.
Well they certainly know it wasn't you who uploaded the movie unless you took two weeks to do it :p

1017.12.2009 9:53
scum101
Inactive

mystic makes a very valid point.. here is a prime example of public money being used to protect private profit and wealth. It's the same as the bail out of the overly greedy banks who are now paying our money to themselves in bonuses.


1117.12.2009 10:38

What makes you think anyone should have free access to someone else's property?

They should go after everyone involved.

If everything were "free", nothing would have value.

And regarding bank "greed" (LOL)... I don't blame folks for accepting bonuses they actually earned per their contractual obligations. Don't slam the recipient, fix the problem (if you think there actually is one) by examining who/how those contracts are written.

If you want the best, you have to pay for it. That's why the laughable CEO "salary caps" won't work, either. Those companies will fail because the best talent will go elsewhere where they will be paid like the best that they are.

1217.12.2009 11:09
scum101
Inactive

you completely miss the point.. this is OUR money that is being used.. to back up the greedy monopolistic and very fat media businesses. They can well afford to stump up the cash themselves.. but no.. again the taxpayer foots the bill. The banks have NO RIGHT to pay out OUR money in bonuses to people who have obviously failed at their jobs if they need bailing out with billions of OUR money.

1317.12.2009 11:25

Originally posted by scum101:
you completely miss the point.. this is OUR money that is being used.. to back up the greedy monopolistic and very fat media businesses. They can well afford to stump up the cash themselves.. but no.. again the taxpayer foots the bill. The banks have NO RIGHT to pay out OUR money in bonuses to people who have obviously failed at their jobs if they need bailing out with billions of OUR money.
Ditto...well put.

1417.12.2009 11:39

They said on the radio that they lost $50,000,000 because of this. Now, do the math at $8 a ticket, that means 6.5 million people downloaded this, and didnt go see the movie in the theater. I think that number is wayyyyy to high, considering there are only 300 million people in the country.

1517.12.2009 12:46

Originally posted by pirkster:
What makes you think anyone should have free access to someone else's property?

They should go after everyone involved.

If everything were "free", nothing would have value.

And regarding bank "greed" (LOL)... I don't blame folks for accepting bonuses they actually earned per their contractual obligations. Don't slam the recipient, fix the problem (if you think there actually is one) by examining who/how those contracts are written.

If you want the best, you have to pay for it. That's why the laughable CEO "salary caps" won't work, either. Those companies will fail because the best talent will go elsewhere where they will be paid like the best that they are.
Ahhh-NO, if you are a honorrible person you don't drive a company into the ground and then take the money and run. I can see you have a lack of morals. As long as you get it in writing then screw everyone, great attitude bud!

1617.12.2009 13:08

What most people is missing is that the FED said it was downloaded in MegaUpload, the question is how they did know that and if MegaUpload supply the information, and if so, what type of impact will have to everyone that use it to upload and download

1717.12.2009 13:19

Originally posted by scum101:
you completely miss the point.. this is OUR money that is being used.. to back up the greedy monopolistic and very fat media businesses. They can well afford to stump up the cash themselves.. but no.. again the taxpayer foots the bill. The banks have NO RIGHT to pay out OUR money in bonuses to people who have obviously failed at their jobs if they need bailing out with billions of OUR money.
It is actually worse... The big banks are getting millions from the Federal treasury at zero or near zero percent interest and then turning around and buying treasury bonds with the fed's [our] own money and earning around three plus percent interest. They are doing the same with the bailout funds. This would be like you giving a no-interest loan to one of your buds and then he loans it back to you and charges you interest, making a profit on your own money.

1817.12.2009 15:29
Daniel_1
Inactive

Originally posted by Necrosaro:
They said on the radio that they lost $50,000,000 because of this. Now, do the math at $8 a ticket, that means 6.5 million people downloaded this, and didnt go see the movie in the theater. I think that number is wayyyyy to high, considering there are only 300 million people in the country.
Dude, your math needs major work. The 300 million you mention is in the US alone. In the whole world there is at least 6 BILLION PEOPLE!. Now subtract 1.5 billion that do not have internet access an that still leaves you with 4.5 Billion people subtract 1 billion that do not want internet access or can get it from their library and that still leaves you with 3.5 Billion people world wide.

Now while not defending these scroats in any way, it is clearly possible that they lost the money they said they did. And not everyone pays 8. a ticket...some pay as much as $15. a ticket and some pay as little as $4 a ticket in the "before 5pm" shows

So you really need to work on your math as in this case if I were your instructor I would give you a failing grade.

1917.12.2009 20:17

I have to say. IF this guy was the original uploader and I stress IF, then he has the punishment coming. I mean, come on. Uploading a movie pre-release that cost millions to make is huge.

Uploading and downloading a few months before the movie goes DVD is one thing, but Woverine was piracy on it's own unique level.

It was cool watching the water tower fight scene where you could see the ropes they were hanging on.

2017.12.2009 21:15

Quote:
Despite the rampant piracy, the movie went on to make over $300 million in the box office, and is the year's second best-selling Blu-ray behind Transformers 2.
If the movie is going to make this kinda money anyway why bother busting this guy. It was a workprint as was said and i would be going for the staff that leaked the workprint more than this guy.

2117.12.2009 23:01

why arn't they prosecuting megauploads.com.after all they allowed 3 million people to download it.


custom built gaming pc from early 2010,ps2 with 15 games all original,ps3 500gbs with 5 games all original,yamaha amp and 5.1channel surround sound speakers,46inch sony lcd smart tv.

2217.12.2009 23:53

Originally posted by xboxdvl2:
why arn't they prosecuting megauploads.com.after all they allowed 3 million people to download it.
I'm sure they are building a case.

This guy might work for Fox, or for a company hired by fox to do something to the workprint. It is possible (but not very likely) that he took the workprint home, made a copy, and brought it back in the morning before anyone showed up. If this is the case, then they need to nail his *** to a wall. If he is just some guy that uploaded what he found on a flashdrive that some guy gave him, he is still guilty as sin...but he is just a patsy.

2318.12.2009 10:21

They really need to start making decent movies again... all this super hero bullshit is getting real fing old. Look at the shiney shiney...

2418.12.2009 12:27

Originally posted by pirkster:
What makes you think anyone should have free access to someone else's property?

They should go after everyone involved.

If everything were "free", nothing would have value.
Well, this movie seemed to have had a $300 million value, even though it was technically available as "free." Not to say that what the uploader did was right. He and whoever else leaked it should face the penalty. But let's look at your statement a little more closely. I agree, if everything were free, nothing would have value. But this movie wasn't free. It was made available. Big difference. The movie studio didn't spend millions to just give it away to the masses. That would be suicide. Someone stole it (or conveniently leaked it from the inside). The bottom line is the value of the movie was what people wanted to pay anyway. The whole "downloading is stealing and costing millions of jobs and billions in revenue each year" argument is horse *!@#.

Originally posted by pirkster:
And regarding bank "greed" (LOL)... I don't blame folks for accepting bonuses they actually earned per their contractual obligations. Don't slam the recipient, fix the problem (if you think there actually is one) by examining who/how those contracts are written.
But the recipient is the problem (LOL). Not sure what this has to do with the topic. Any thoughts on the US health care debate?

2518.12.2009 13:59
Daniel_1
Inactive

Quote:
Any thoughts on the US health care debate?
Yes, it is illegal and unconstitutional and any Democrat or Republican that votes for it in it's present state is willfully and intentionally committing a federal felony.

You MUST buy insurance...right? Ok how are you going to not buy insurance or answer that question if asked without incriminating yourself, so even asking that question would be a violation of the 5th Amendment of the US Constitution.

You MUST buy insurance right? Ok, then how are they going to enforce this when the US Supreme Court ( Schechter Poultry Corp. v. United States, 295 U.S. 495, 55 S. Ct. 837, 79 L. Ed. 1570 (1935) ) has already stated in a 9-0 decision that the US Congress CANNOT and DOES NOT have the authority to force anyone to buy anything. If this was the case then what is stopping them from demanding that the ONLY apples you can buy are from Washington State, or the ONLY potatoes you can buy are from Idaho, or the ONLY car/truck you can buy is a GM made one. They can regulate traffic between states (and one wonders then why they just dont open up the ability for you to buy insurance from another state then) but that is where their authority ends.

So let them pass this, and all one would need do is file a federal class action lawsuit against ALL members of Congress (both house and senate) that voted for this and we could essentially clean house in COngress as every person that voted for it would be found guilty of the willful and intentional commission of a federal felony and under Title 18 United States Code (USC) it clearly states that "NO convicted felon shall hold, be appointed to, nor placed in a decision making position of, in or with any elective office in the United States" IN laymens terms, that means every person that voted for this would be removed from office and barred from ever running for office ever again as well as being banned from voting or having anything to do with any election AND being banned from receiving any form of retirement from the State in which they reside nor the US Treasury.

So let the dumarses vote for it, tiz political suicide.

2627.12.2009 3:30

@daniel
Cutting the bull crap, why don't you tell us why exactly are you against the health reform?
Whatever logic you find in your argument, and citing all that constitutional jargon- is not impressive at all, hanging on some flawed semantics. Why don't you find some knuckleheads and start a class action joke against all the legislators that voted for mandatory car insurance in different states(by the way, MANDATORY means people are FORCED to buy it, or suffer consequences)))...? I am sure your logic would win in court...
"Unconstitutional,people cannot be FORCED to buy insurance, cannot be forced to buy anything"- Are you joking?? That's the whole idea, to make it afordable for everyone, in which case no one will be bloody forced to buy anything, they will gladly do it.
Is the idea that the guy that cuts your grass, and has an income 100x lower than yours, could some day afford medical insurance comparable to yours so hard to deal with?

This message has been edited since its posting. Latest edit was made on 27 Dec 2009 @ 3:43

2727.12.2009 8:03
Daniel_1
Inactive

Originally posted by cyprusrom:
@daniel
Cutting the bull crap, why don't you tell us why exactly are you against the health reform?
Whatever logic you find in your argument, and citing all that constitutional jargon- is not impressive at all, hanging on some flawed semantics. Why don't you find some knuckleheads and start a class action joke against all the legislators that voted for mandatory car insurance in different states(by the way, MANDATORY means people are FORCED to buy it, or suffer consequences)))...? I am sure your logic would win in court...
"Unconstitutional,people cannot be FORCED to buy insurance, cannot be forced to buy anything"- Are you joking?? That's the whole idea, to make it afordable for everyone, in which case no one will be bloody forced to buy anything, they will gladly do it.
Is the idea that the guy that cuts your grass, and has an income 100x lower than yours, could some day afford medical insurance comparable to yours so hard to deal with?
Ok Knucklehead, how about I teach you the real reason in one fell swoop.

1. Congress has no authority to require any citizen to buy anything.
"Schechter Poultry Corp. v. United States, 295 U.S. 495, 55 S. Ct. 837, 79 L. Ed. 1570 (1935) US Supreme Court" Because it is an unconstitutional Abdication of the legislative power vested in Congress by Article I, Section 1, of the U.S. Constitution. As well as a Violation of Article I, Section 8, Clause 3, of the Constitution and that the procedures for enforcing forcing you to buy insurance or anything else for that matter violated the due process clause of the Fifth Amendment; nor can the US Congress with hold any federal funds to force the state to do this as this would be an agreement under duress and also illegal under state and federal laws. In short knucklehead, Congress, if they did have this power; could force you to only buy apples from Washington State or Cars from GM or Computers from Microsoft. They cannot do this and never could and anyone who tells you they can or thinks they can are either way too ignorant of American law to even own a computer, or are just too damn stupid to be allowed to use one. Besides, all the people who are on line whining and complaining about this health care crap could very easily not own a computer and take that money they used to buy this as well as the money they use for internet access each month and BUY them a policy. Nowhere in the US Constitution does it say that health care is a right or should be available to everyone no matter what anyone tells you.

As for the States requiring you to buy insurance, that is like apples to oranges. Under the Commerce Clause, Congress has the power to regulate commerce between the states, not intrastate commerce; and they very well could open up the Insurance market to allow you to join into a group and buy bulk insurance from other states....so ask yourself why they still refuse to do this if they are so damned concerned? The power to enact legislation on intrastate commerce was reserved to the states under the Tenth Amendment to the Constitution, as such the individual states CAN force the citizens to buy auto insurance as they use the roads inside that state and must have a way to compensate people for damage to their selves or personal property if the driver of a car damages it. And remember, the US Supreme Court has already stated that the Federal Congress does not have that right and never has. Sorta blows a hole in your idiotic argument now dont it?

So how can they force anyone to admit they dont have insurance? The answer is they CANNOT. If they require you to answer and you say "no insurance" and they fine you, you have just incriminated yourself under the 5th Amendment of the US Constitution and as such it is inadmissable in a court of law in the US and it cannot be enforced as to do so would violate the 5th Amendment and thus cause the person trying to fine you for this to be charged with the willful and intentional violation of the US Constitution and federal law. Can they demand or force you to answer? Nope, they cannot, as if the Feds try this they are causing you to answer under duress and any statement made under duress is also inadmissable in a court of law as well as a violation of state and federal laws in the US. So tell me knucklehead, just how the hell are they going to enforce this when they are banned and barred by the US Constitution and federal/state laws on even ASKING if you have insurance or not? And South Carolina-Nevada-Michigan and Washington state as well as 29 other states have all joined into a possible class action lawsuit against the US Congress for this idiotic and illegal mandate forcing you to buy anything based on the 10th Amendment-the 5th Amendment and the 14th Amendment of the US Constitution as well as it violates the tax laws of the 16th Amendment that clearly states that ANY tax MUST be divided equally between all the citizens of the US so each person pays a portion. Therefor the tax increase on people making $200,000 or more each year is illegal and unconstitutional as well as giving anyone else money to buy this insurance and not giving me the same amount no matter of my financial history or not as to do otherwise again is illegal and a violation of the 16th Amendment that requires the taxes to be spread EQUALLY to all citizens of the US.

So now that you have been schooled knucklehead, you can go home and tell mommy and daddy that you failed and are going to be held back in school until you have the common sense and intelligence to be promoted to the next grade level. As it is obvious that you clearly dont have either at he present time.

And I would bet that you still believe that lie about the mythical 47 to 50 million without health insurance now dont you?

2827.12.2009 10:04

Daniel_1, Good arguments. The problem is, your arguments are based on the premise that the govt. actually values the constitution. The Obama administration does not.

Although the self incrimination issue is indeed going to the supreme court, the govt. will massage the bill until it too has a clause similar to the state roads/10th amendment.

On a side note to knucklehead. This health care bill as it sits will play a major roll in the further decline of our economy. When, and I stress WHEN, Obama's 'rob Peter to pay Paul' economics begin to self correct, it's going to send us hurling into a deeper depression then we're in now.

2927.12.2009 11:13

Gee, thanks for the lesson...Too bad I usually skip to the closing paragraph, that usually tells you about someone's worth, it saved me a 2 minutes read.
My idiotic argument...how are they gonna do it? Don't know yet, haven't seen the final draft, Obama will fax it to me by the end of the day...
I see, you're a good citizen concerned about the budget deficit...I am sure financial responsibility is a good excuse for your opposition, and the only excuse??...You must be one of the guys that also opposed Bush's tax cuts and the Iraq war that dented the budget with over 2 trillions...of course in the name of freedom. If the health care reform would be for the good of regular Americans, that would maybe be a good idea, right?

"And I would bet that you still believe that lie about the mythical 47 to 50 million without health insurance now dont you?"

There isn't anything mythical about it. And I really don't know if the numbers are skewed one way or another.Maybe isn't even half of that. I don't need to read what other people compute as to be the true. I see the "mythical" people when I am at work, some that would be bankrupt, some sent home with no care,or bounced between half a dozen bureaucrats that "might" find a way to give them some decent medical care to someone that makes only minimum wage...You're talking about the jobless, or the ones with absolutely no insurance...how about the ones that have some insurance, but unfortunately is only good if they are not sick, the moment they do get sick would only buy them an aspirin?

Good people are at work, eventually your doorman will have comparable medical care with yours...

This message has been edited since its posting. Latest edit was made on 27 Dec 2009 @ 11:42

3027.12.2009 12:45
Daniel_1
Inactive

Originally posted by cyprusrom:
Gee, thanks for the lesson...Too bad I usually skip to the closing paragraph, that usually tells you about someone's worth, it saved me a 2 minutes read.
My idiotic argument...how are they gonna do it? Don't know yet, haven't seen the final draft, Obama will fax it to me by the end of the day...
I see, you're a good citizen concerned about the budget deficit...I am sure financial responsibility is a good excuse for your opposition, and the only excuse??...You must be one of the guys that also opposed Bush's tax cuts and the Iraq war that dented the budget with over 2 trillions...of course in the name of freedom. If the health care reform would be for the good of regular Americans, that would maybe be a good idea, right?

"And I would bet that you still believe that lie about the mythical 47 to 50 million without health insurance now dont you?"

There isn't anything mythical about it. And I really don't know if the numbers are skewed one way or another.Maybe isn't even half of that. I don't need to read what other people compute as to be the true. I see the "mythical" people when I am at work, some that would be bankrupt, some sent home with no care,or bounced between half a dozen bureaucrats that "might" find a way to give them some decent medical care to someone that makes only minimum wage...You're talking about the jobless, or the ones with absolutely no insurance...how about the ones that have some insurance, but unfortunately is only good if they are not sick, the moment they do get sick would only buy them an aspirin?

Good people are at work, eventually your doorman will have comparable medical care with yours...
Before you put your foot any deeper into your mouth child, be aware that I am a 100% Service Connected Disabled Vet who will die from his wounds and or complications thereof to give you the right to be an smart arsed twit like your post shows. I have never asked for anything from anyone and I worked hard for everything I ever received in life, including the 30+ years of working at the same job. I never allowed anyone to know about me playing a "Secret Santa" to people of low incomes who could not afford a Christmas. I never told anyone except my family of me taking 10% of my pay EACH WEEK and placing it into a bank account (and yes my bank will validate this) and then receiving names from families on Welfare and using that money to either buy them a Christmas or give them cash to help in a financial bind. I worked it out with a worker there to call them in and take them in another room and give them these gifts and tell them it was anonymous. When my electric cart that I use was replaced I asked to be able to keep the cart and was granted that request. I then with my own cash rebuilt the cart so it looked brand new and then GAVE IT to another needy person instead of allowing it to be thrown away. I volunteer in soup kitchens and I volunteer at the march of Dimes as well as at the Sr Center and Community center in my city. So DONT YOU DARE sit there on your self erected high horse and try your childish BS with me boy, I quite probably do more for charity in one week then you do in 6 months. When was the last time you took a warm coat to a person that needed it, or offered a ride to the doctor or grocery store, or paid for a family's christmas or took a warm meal to a person that would probably never get one without it, or just visited a shut in to let them talk and show them a kind face?


So before you start acting like the putz you sound like you are, get your arse out and actually start DOING something before you chide others with your poor sarcastic jabs. Then and ONLY then can you come back here and try and make someone else feel guilty for their beliefs.


So how does it feel to be forced to eat crow and have your whole argument blow up in your face because you spoke first before you allowed your brain to start working?

3127.12.2009 13:15
Daniel_1
Inactive

Oh and cyprusrom? Here are the facts on that mythical 47 to 50 million uninsured crap from the exact SAME 2000 Census that this fake number came from.

Out of the mythical 47 million uninsured:

10 Million are Illegals and are violating the law just by being here and cannot be counted for federal tax monies anyway. Source US 2000 Census

You are now down to 37 million

14 Million have never bothered to get insurance because they dont think they will ever need it. Hence the reason for them to try and force you to buy health insurance to bring these people into the fold, even though they legally and constitutionally cannot do it. Source Present Health Care Bills in Senate and House and US 2000 Census

Now you are down to 23 million

17.6 million have incomes above $50,000 and can afford to buy their own insurance without making me pay for it via taxes and another 9.1 million of that 17.6 million mentioned above have incomes ABOVE $75,000 and they can buy their own insurance as well. Source Present Health Care Bills in Senate and House and US 2000 Census and JAMA and the AMA

So now you are down to 5.9 million

Out of the 5.9 million left 5 million qualify for medicade-medicare-SCHIP. So that, my math challenged friend leaves a grand total of 897,285 people in the US without any health care or long term health care. Again my source? Source Present Health Care Bills in Senate and House and US 2000 Census and JAMA and the AMA

So tell me einstein, why screw with the health care of 100% of the nation just to help less then 1/300th of the nation? And this is something that just galls the hell out of you as you cannot blame Bush for this and a 10th of all jobs in the nation VANISHED ON OBAMA'S WATCH!! Could that be why his approval rating is below 43% according to Gallup-Rasmussen-Zogby-Time Warner-USA Today polls? And the US Congress's ratings are down below 10% according to the same polls? Or why the Democrats are going to take a schelacking in November? Or why over HALF (33) of the states in the US are banding together to file a Constitutional Challenge to this health care travesty? Or why over 30 of them have passed laws REFUSING to go along with Congress demands and over 29 States have passed resolutions into law that if the US Congress DARES so much as to hold ANY road monies or anything like that until the states comply; said states will REFUSE to send one more tax dime to the US Congress or the US Treasury and use it inside the individual states. What is the Congress going to do then? Make them do it by force? Oh PLEASE try that and you will have a civil war on your hands so fast that it will make your heads spin and every arsehole in the US Congress that tries this will be FORCEABLY removed from office as the citizens will not stand for this.

So you keep dreaming your left wing rants there cyprusrom, but you had better hope to whatever deity you believe in that Congress wises up VERY fast as the citizens of this country are at the endo fo their ropes and they are NOT going to take this crap much longer before they take action!

3227.12.2009 13:52

Look man, obviously we're on the different side of the fence, and we're never gonna agree about any detail. You keep believing in what you want,and hope that your illusion becomes reality. You're talking about millions in statistics written by...whoever?

That's one of the main problems, many people that make life long decisions for an entire nation care more about statistics,polls, and publicity rather than being concerned about the people.Worry about looking bad or lose a nice cushioned congress seat, so they don't do squat.
I definitely don't like what I see in the day to day living, not in statistics. You are painting such rosy life, everybody is so happy and healthy, don't mess with it. C'mon,it would be nice if the reality were like that. But it isn't. I work in a hospital. I see it.

The jobs didn't just vanish in less than a year...It's been a long process down the drain. The house prices didn't get overinflated overnight...it happened on somebody else's watch. Popping up in a public forum and copy/paste from some sources that have their own interest, is pointless. You and I fighting here claiming that we know the law better than anyone else, useless as well. I guess time will tell.

3327.12.2009 16:07
Daniel_1
Inactive

Originally posted by cyprusrom:
Look man, obviously we're on the different side of the fence, and we're never gonna agree about any detail. You keep believing in what you want,and hope that your illusion becomes reality. You're talking about millions in statistics written by...whoever?

That's one of the main problems, many people that make life long decisions for an entire nation care more about statistics,polls, and publicity rather than being concerned about the people.Worry about looking bad or lose a nice cushioned congress seat, so they don't do squat.
I definitely don't like what I see in the day to day living, not in statistics. You are painting such rosy life, everybody is so happy and healthy, don't mess with it. C'mon,it would be nice if the reality were like that. But it isn't. I work in a hospital. I see it.

The jobs didn't just vanish in less than a year...It's been a long process down the drain. The house prices didn't get overinflated overnight...it happened on somebody else's watch. Popping up in a public forum and copy/paste from some sources that have their own interest, is pointless. You and I fighting here claiming that we know the law better than anyone else, useless as well. I guess time will tell.
It's a real be-yatch when reality intrudes on your beliefs aint it? Happened to me before and the only help I can give you is this quote from Thomas Jefferson "When my beliefs and reality conflict, I have no other option then to change my beliefs. Exactly what do you do sir?". My facts figures and sources really blow a hole in what in what you hold dear and for that my apologies, but you now have to do some thinking to do. Do you continue on with your beliefs even when they were proven wrong, or do you adjust your beliefs to bring them in line with reality even if it means being in conflict with friends and even family who refuse to do the same? Only you can answer that.

And the jobs that vanished since jan 21 2009 all fall on Obama's watch since he was in office at that time. You cannot have it any other way as if what happened during Bush-Clinton-Reagan-Ford or Carter's terms are their responsibility, then the same falls to the massive job loss that has happened during Obama's term. And unless he gets this corrected by November...the Democrats are going to take a massive beating in the elections and quite a few of them (Pelosi-Reed-Scheumer-Dodd-Lincoln-and close to 130 other Democrats are either going to be in the fight of their lives or they are going to be thrown out and beaten so badly that they would never be elected street sweeper. And every one of these 130 Democrats are either trailing badly in the polls (reed has almost a 20 point loss and Pelosi has a 7 point loss. Scheumer has a 10 point loss Lincoln is over 25 points behind and Mary Landrue might as well not even bother to run for re-election as according to La polls, she is right now 35 points in the hole according to Zogby and Rasmussen and Gallup)And according to the US Department of Labor, everything I have stated about the job loss is factual and can be documented. Hell even kooks like the Daily Kos-Huff'n'Puffington and Firedummylake all are turning against the Democrats and Obama BIG TIME. I mean Obama still has the support of the African American community, but even THAT has dropped over 35 points from where it was in January and is dangerously coming close to the 50% mark, and if it drops below that...he is toast and will not be re-elected. And right now it is in the mid 60% range.

As for me knowing the law, I will say it again as I said it before... I know the law quite probably better then most people in this forum including you as my MOS was 71Delta when I was in the military. That is a Legal Aide for the US Army JAG Corps. Therefor you can take what I have said to the bank as I dont say anything I cannot prove.

So your choice is simple. You can clean up your world as it has been overturned with reality, and join the rest of us, or you can continue on as you are going and be in for a very RUDE wake up call in 2010.

3427.12.2009 16:26

Hmmm...I think I am rather sure what the reality is...Is not my believes that shape my reality, is vice-versa. And the reality is not pretty...There are too many people that hold 2-3 jobs and can't make it to the surface,are in debt because of medical bills or denied care altogether...Too many people that the only thing their insurance covers is the diagnosis...will tell you you're sick for your monthly fee, but will cost you dearly to get any treatment...

The issue is not simple, there are plenty of states that have done a decent job in extended coverage for the needed, and I am sure aren't happy in picking up the slack of some other states where the dirt bags politicians didn't do anything. But to say everything is working and the system needs no change, is just naive, foolish if you actually believe it.

3527.12.2009 19:16

I seen the leaked version and still rented it when it came out. I only buy a few movies on blu-ray, I just saw it at wal-mart for $14 cad on blu-ray didnt get it though.

Even if I didnt see it before, there was no way i was going to the theatre to see it i go there like once a year if that and the movie has to be amazing to make me go there.

price isnt a issue its the kids, kicking of seats, people talking, people getting up, phones ringing, and most of all seating. I spent thousands on my own tv setup and surround sound so i dont ever have to go to these places and get pissed off.

3627.12.2009 20:53

When did the FBI catch Osama bin Laden? I thought he was responsible for 9-11.

I guess arresting Jose the uploader was more important.

Oh well, if Jose doesn't have a record he'll be going to a Federal prison "camp". These can actually be fun. That's where all the big-time financial crooks go to do their time. Joe Nacchio is doing his six years at the camp called Schuylkill FCI in Minersville, Pennsylvania. Here's a link to a post about this camp by a recent former inmate there.

http://fprison.wordpress.com

$30,000 a year to house Jose the uploader plus another $50,000+ for the investigation and prosecution. Then when Jose gets out he'll hit this wonderful job market as an ex-convict. That means he'll become a suicide risk. Probably an angry suicide risk too considering what ruined his life.

Can you say "going postal"? That's the new American religion, "Going Postal", also the name of a very good book by Mark Ames. You can find it at Amazon.

3728.12.2009 0:17
Daniel_1
Inactive

Originally posted by cyprusrom:
Hmmm...I think I am rather sure what the reality is...Is not my believes that shape my reality, is vice-versa. And the reality is not pretty...There are too many people that hold 2-3 jobs and can't make it to the surface,are in debt because of medical bills or denied care altogether...Too many people that the only thing their insurance covers is the diagnosis...will tell you you're sick for your monthly fee, but will cost you dearly to get any treatment...

The issue is not simple, there are plenty of states that have done a decent job in extended coverage for the needed, and I am sure aren't happy in picking up the slack of some other states where the dirt bags politicians didn't do anything. But to say everything is working and the system needs no change, is just naive, foolish if you actually believe it.
And I challenge you to show exactly where I made that statement or even implied same

3828.12.2009 0:26
Daniel_1
Inactive

Originally posted by Tecbot:
I seen the leaked version and still rented it when it came out. I only buy a few movies on blu-ray, I just saw it at wal-mart for $14 cad on blu-ray didnt get it though.

Even if I didnt see it before, there was no way i was going to the theatre to see it i go there like once a year if that and the movie has to be amazing to make me go there.

price isnt a issue its the kids, kicking of seats, people talking, people getting up, phones ringing, and most of all seating. I spent thousands on my own tv setup and surround sound so i dont ever have to go to these places and get pissed off.
I agree with you. I walk with braces and a cane and most of the time I have to use an electric cart just to get around, as well as numerous other surgeries on my back and other parts of me all dealing with my military injuries. One thing I cannot stand is to go to a theater and pay between 15 and 30 bucks for a ticket and then have it spoiled because some moron decided to get the 3 gallon soda special and drink it all BEFORE the movie. Now they have to go to the crapper every 15 or 20 minutes and guess who they just have to make move so they can get past? Or the people who bring in 6 month old babies who start crying and now we have to wait for the parent to get the good sense to leave the theater with the infant, or someone providing commentary all through the movie. And if I want a snack, I dont have to pay $8. for a blasted soda and $5. for a box of popcorn or $4. for a two month old box of candy

I have not been to a theater in quite a while for these exact reasons, the last time I was at a theater was a midnight showing of Lord of the Rings and I have not been back since. I either buy the dvd's I want or I rent them via Netflix. And until they change some of these items, I dont for see me going to a theater anytime in the near future.

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