AfterDawn: Tech news

Record labels want to tax music phones

Written by Petteri Pyyny (Google+) @ 20 Nov 2006 10:53 User comments (70)

Record labels want to tax music phones Today, all the major lobby organizations of the recording industry jointly announced that they want to start charging cell phone manufacturers a levy for each cell phone sold that is capable of playing MP3s or other music formats.
Organizations (Kopiosto, Gramex, Teosto and Tuotos) claim that the current situation in Finland, where stand-alone MP3 players, like Apple's iPod, carry a levy upto 15 euros ($19.22), is unfair as the phones that are marketed as "music phones" escape the levy fee.

Considering that world's largest mobile phone manufacturer, Nokia, is a Finnish company (and employs almost 25,000 people in Finland -- a country with a population of just over 5M), it would be interesting to see how this requirement is responded by the consumer electronics lobby organizations who have fought against the extremely draconian levy fee system of Finland for years. Then again, considering how the Finnish government handled the last year's copyright reform, it is quite likely that the recording industry will succeed.

In Finland, labels currently collect levy (a nice word for private taxation) for these items among others:
  • blank CDR media - €0.20
  • blank DVDR media - upto €1.21 (and yes, the money goes to the record labels not to movie studios..)
  • blank VHS cassettes - €1.82 for 4h tape
  • portable audio players - upto €15
  • digital video players, digital set-top boxes, PVR devices, etc - upto €15
Furthermore, there are virtually no Finnish Net radios due the extremely high copyright fees labels seek from Net broadcasting, taxis have to pay a fixed fee for having their radio on when accepting customers and three years ago labels started seeking royalties from day nurseries for singing nursery rhymes.

More information:

Teosto (in Finnish only)

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70 user comments

120.11.2006 11:26

I feel that this is just going over the top again. How many organizations want to police this area of digital music. To me these organizations just see that there is money in this area of the market and they wonder how they can also get a piece of the pie. Give me a break :)

220.11.2006 11:47

Why the heck?

320.11.2006 11:53

Its organizations like this that prompt people like me to go to P2P filesharing and end up getting everything for nothing. I'm not proud to say i'm a pirate. But what other choice do they give me. This world has taught people to be consumers. Well...i am consuming for FREE now...because all the greedy organizations with high prices, taxes, etc...push me that way. They are going to scare off good artists because they its going to be too hard to make some real $$$ in this area. If i lived in Finnland...i might be one to SNAP !!! and go on a SNAPPING SPREE ! What a world we live in. U greedy bastards are going to come right back down to earth after u die and become a poor consumer...just like me. Your just to stupid to see the big picture. GREED is not the answer

420.11.2006 12:16
mark5hs
Inactive

music companies charging a fee for music players would be like game developers charging a fee for consoles sold...

520.11.2006 13:24

soon they'll sue blank media companies for every CDR or DVDR that is sold. Or even better, back-taxes for every Sony Walkman or record player. Hell, lets sue every car manufacturer for including tape/CD players in their cars, or computer companies for packaging music playing software. Better yet, lets just put the developer of the mp3 compression format in jail, that will solve all our problems.

620.11.2006 13:41

I can make fart music with my ass. Do they want to tax that too? I do a great Deep Purple song. No pun intended. Record labels can burn/rot in hell!

720.11.2006 14:40

Is it April 1st already?? This is really retarded for the record companies to be doing this.

820.11.2006 15:04

@limelight




I hate to read about these bad news...

This message has been edited since its posting. Latest edit was made on 20 Nov 2006 @ 15:07

920.11.2006 15:05
gogochar
Inactive

Oh crap. The end is near.

1020.11.2006 16:40

What a boat-load of garbage. This is going over the edge. I can't believe they'll go as far as this in Finland. This is sad....

1120.11.2006 16:54

I would not mind if the goverment speted in and put a 1% tax on digi devices blank cd/dvds and the internet and new computers and then made all shearing and downloading leagle so then the mafaa could not bully the people anymore. the only thign to be licit is the selling of copies.

1220.11.2006 17:07

Good point, but I doubt these stinking money-hungry companies are ready to go that way.

1320.11.2006 17:33
duckNrun
Inactive

hell no that aint! They want the money from the devices so that EVERYONE has to compensate them for this supposed loss of revenue they suffer when people put illegal stuff on them AND they also want these same people to pay for the music that they put on these devices as well.. Sad thing is with all the taxes you guys over there already pay it's easy to stuff another one down your throat. And don't buy a Zune because this device has to FAIL only to make sure that the industry isn't able to point to it's success and say see now Mr. (name a media device) YOU need to give us some of your profits as well... MS doing that pissed me off enough to finally download some Linux distros and as soon as I can get a CD to burn them to I'll see just how badly I really need MS....

1420.11.2006 17:43

Okay now I don't know which side to support anymore. If I can get a strong argument from each side, I'll decide the one I'm on.

1520.11.2006 17:51
duckNrun
Inactive

sorry I didn't mean hell no that aint a good point.. I meant hell no that aint gonna happen. After spending some time looking around for my **edit** function I gave up lol

1620.11.2006 18:31

What's next, prison time for car manufacturers because cars can be used for a variety of crimes?

1720.11.2006 19:09
duckNrun
Inactive

nah, those companies affected by crime will simply get a crime tax placed upon all cars so as to cover their losses... but don't think that means you can go get a free steak from the grocery! lol

1820.11.2006 20:07

I think that all companies that make devices that music can be played on ought to ask the recording industries for a tax n every song that could be played on thier devices. because you know that people are going to use thier devices to play music.....

1921.11.2006 4:12
LazyWorkr
Inactive

This is insanity! How did this get to be this bad?

2021.11.2006 6:02
Javafriek
Inactive

Come on give me a break here, I felt my IQ plunge after reading this. Charging royalties to day nurseries for singing nursery rhymes??!! What the? Tsk Tsk. Greed..one of the seven deadly sins.

2121.11.2006 6:48

now they want a slice off the top even if your not using the mp3 player on your phone.. god how much money does it take to keep pditty and his crones out of jail ... this is the excuse of the month hey next they will want a part of the psp and the wii and then they will want to tax my great aunt fanny because she can sing in a shower... hey "RIAA listion up we are all tired of your politics and your blightant missuse of our court system why dont you just dry up and go away this was the land of the free befor your serpent sized brain came into focuse on this issue let it go were not interested in what you got to say" the last time we americans got pushed this far we had a tea party maybe it's time for an "I.T." party .....

2221.11.2006 7:15

Javafriek nursery rhymes are free use. frankly its time the governments of the world made a 1% tax one digi devices and blank CD/DVD and make downloading and shearing leagle makeing the only thing licit is selling copies.

2321.11.2006 7:51

so they get free healthcare but companies basicaly gte to make up taxes whenever they see fit? this is one file sharing news article from europe that makes me proud to be american

2421.11.2006 14:56

Why cant I charge them for songs played over the air. I did not request them to take up air waves through my yard. I feel a tax should be paid to me for all the commercials, music, sound waves that I dont request "because they suck" going through my house. My love for all music has gone into the sewage system.

2521.11.2006 14:58

sssharp you dont own your land the gov can take it away any tie it wants :P

2621.11.2006 18:05

Don't we pay enough for things, beside all these extra taxes they try to force on everyone. Enough is enough - big business gets richer and richer, and people get poorer and poorer. All I have to say; when people get tired of all this crap - boycott(big business will maybe learn their leason about being greedy).

2721.11.2006 19:09

Finland what a great place to go and rob a bank since the police will be out there busting people for singing to themselves. And everytime my phone rings playing AC/DC they will be chasing me down for money.

2822.11.2006 6:17

Quote:
Finland what a great place to go and rob a bank since the police will be out there busting people for singing to themselves
yep... i think polices just try to caught all illegal music downloaders in here, finland...

2922.11.2006 7:17

isnt this site finnish? have the movie companies ever tried to fuck with afterdawn? i know afterdawn isnt alowed to give out guides on how to crack dvd encryption but they are alowed to let "other" people post how to do it on their site...

3022.11.2006 7:54

georgeluv yes they had to remove some tools a few months/year ago when the laws were updated..

3123.11.2006 0:15

yes the moderators deleted all guides which help to copy cd's, and make some new rules.

3223.11.2006 1:16

blank DVDR media - upto €1.21 (and yes, the mobey goes to the record labels not to movie studios..)

3325.11.2006 4:05

Oddest thing happened today. I had a great bowel movement this morning. So good in fact, I'd rate it a 9.5. About 5 minutes later, the American Standard toiled company called to collect what they called a "great s..t tax."

3425.11.2006 4:35

Greedy SOB's!

3525.11.2006 13:41
peterj76
Inactive

DOH this is crazy.... The record company make thier money at the point of sale. This concept of a second cash in to me sucks. Should the Holden and Ford motor company take 20% of my wages, becuase without it I wouldnt get to work...

3625.11.2006 16:53
IMG
Inactive

I got busted in Finnland the other day, simply for walking down the street while whistling the tune, "My Sweet Lord" by George Harrison. The funny thing is, I had to pay royalties to HIS record label AND to the one that handles the song "He's So Fine", since they couldn't decide which song I was actually whistling at the time. I'm actually getting to the point where I would love to see some radical islamic neo-fascist group blow up the RIAA headquarters, the government idiots in Finnland who is trying put this type of law into place, and any other greedy bastards who truly deserve it. I'm not saying that anybody should actually DO it, I'm saying I would laugh my ass off IF it ever happened. POETIC JUSTICE! BTW, whatever the hell happened to FREE SPEECH?

3725.11.2006 17:38

IMG free speach is a misnomer ,only a few countries have it like the US and only the US and acoupel others have it so its hard to remove liek the US,and even in the US its on shakey ground if you question the the shrub&chief *rolls eyes*

3825.11.2006 20:12

How about a tax on every baby born, because at some stage they might be able to sing!!

3925.11.2006 23:06

the only way to hurt these homo if they get there way would be a no buy on cell phones with mp3 .it wouldnt take long for phone makers to fight back .

4026.11.2006 1:11

How much is the price of the £9.99 MP3 players going to be? Can I get a refund against music I don't want to hear from other players, in the tube for example.

4126.11.2006 4:25
snige
Inactive

let me get this straight....You actually get fined for singing on the streets of Finland???! Surely not?

4226.11.2006 4:30

Whoooosh!

4326.11.2006 5:47
Bremen
Inactive

Sounds like them.... Guitar tabs are under the same attack...people saying that they are illegal b/c its free dist of music.....bull*hit is all i have to say..

4426.11.2006 6:36

that is absolute crap, that really pisses me off.

4526.11.2006 6:44

Heil !heil!heil! to the new world mafia heil!heil!

4626.11.2006 8:43
IMG
Inactive

"Vee haf our wayss of controlling zee werld!" "Zigarette, old man?" "AHHHHHHHHHHH!" "Oh, WOW, man, he stuck it in his eye!" ***All kidding and Cheech & Chong references aside, the music / movie NAZI's will rule just as long as we allow them to do so! VOTE THEM OUT OF OFFICE NOW! Just remember, all Bush bashing aside, in absolutely ALL cases here in the USA, it has been the LIBERALS and DEMOCRATS who have infringed upon our personal liberties more than any other political or social group (Al & Tipper Gore in the 1980's with the bullshit PMRC nonsense, for example, and a HUGE volume of SHOCKING legislation from Clinton during his illegal and immoral criminal "presidency"). Liberals will be the death of us all if we let them. It's time for the MODERATES to rule a while!

4726.11.2006 13:33
Ballpyhon
Inactive

things are really starting to go to far with the whole copyright infringement issue. Finland has far surpassed the norm. Singing nursery rhymes in a preschool is infringement?? what if they decided not to sing anymore in nursery school? what will happen to the development of their children? do the parents of the children have to pay taxes when they sing to them? all that aside, is it necessary to squeeze every cent out of the public? what are they afraid they are going to lose? I am a proud American who DID NOT vote for Bush. I pray that the U.S. does not get to this point.

4926.11.2006 14:01

Ballpyhon don't think the dems are much better they are in holly woods and the mafias pockets even more 0-o f corse...the dems are as inrested in banning games as they are balancing the budget 0-o

5026.11.2006 14:20

a long deep sigh!

5126.11.2006 14:25

Sadly money goes where the power is and nothing goes together as well as politics and money ;_;

5227.11.2006 2:25

how can you put up with such a thing, people? Nothing of this kind is possible in Russia. A ban to sing rhymes!!!That sounds completely crazy.I would thought of our politicians to be the first off the hinge. And now it turned out to be a mistake

5327.11.2006 2:26
JaiQwan
Inactive

Ballpyhon:
Ummm I hate to be the one say this,

BUT

The US Of A sure is trying to go down this road as we speak here and now. If you or anyone here has not seen or heard this as of yet, I Urge you and everyone to do their part in the good Fight. Check out the Link http://www.savetheinternet.com/

Okay back to our Regular Programing. I maybe showing my age here, but what happened to the days when you could make your own cassett tapes and share it with your friends and now days when you can make your own CD of music and share it with your friends. This world is really getting to be more and more (Its All About The Money) and Frell The people!!

And this is a topic that can go on and on here, and we can all get Frelling Pissed and all but to really make change, The People Have To come together and speak as one, If I was over there I would seek out and support the group that is if there is one that is trying to fight this insane Tax, this is really getting out of hand, because of they can get away with in Finnish then they will only do it else where.

This message has been edited since its posting. Latest edit was made on 27 Nov 2006 @ 6:37

5427.11.2006 2:45

I think boycott on a great scale would be more effective measure to stop them. They want an extra cash in ? Cut them to the quick right away!in my opinion all other action are either illegal or inefficient.

5527.11.2006 3:32

Sen Orin Hatch who is a Republican is responsible for most of the legislation on this stuff. He writes songs and has recorded so he has a vested interest. So stop blaming the so called liberals.

5627.11.2006 6:47

Jerrysr1 really the only difference in dem/rep lib/fundie is the different way in which they screw you over.... frankly this will not change untill the corporate tit is removed from the politician feeding machine it tends to make them fat and dumb anyway removal of it will help smooth out the idiot bumps in the road to the future. there was a reason why church and state were separated theres a eaquly compiling reason to do so with corperations/large business's/Large pools of money

5727.11.2006 9:47

Do you want a political party (entity) that has actually developed a sensible IP policy? Try the Libertarian Party; http://www.lp.org/

5827.11.2006 9:55

AUDIOMIND I liked the greens 3-5 years back I have been throughly disgusted with everything since lord god bush and co. been in office,the greens are a front for the dems the libs a front for the reps,there really is no solid 3rd part that wants to fight the corruption in government they just want a piece of the pie by paying wolfs in sheeples clothing....... until better term limits and the recreation of lobbyisim as we know it...its all the same heads of the same old people/consumer eating hydra ;_;

5927.11.2006 13:12

Though I'd have to respectfully disagree about the LP being an extension of the republicrats (though they are a conservative party w/ a liberal sense of freedom, particularly individually), I do agree that term limits remains one of the BIGGEST FACTORs contributing to the venality in all sectors of GovCo. (Federal, state & local)

Most others I've spoken with have no idea that about the only 'representatives' that are term limited are senators, presidents & governors. Most others are 'districted' to remain incumbent for life. (Especially those dinosaur politicos in the federal house of representatives and in state houses)

Many believe that the 'experienced' politician tends to breed legislation that is devoid of corruption and abounds in positive acumen, but that deception couldn't be further from the truth. Primarily because of the lack of term limits (which in turn would lead to new blood, ideas and direction) and 3rd parties, the other two entrenched parties (and incumbents) implement some of the most pathetic and absurd legislative schemes known to man, for they have almost no fear of losing reelection. The percentage is above the 90s: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Congression...e_United_States

I’ve also been thoroughly disgusted with the current set of criminals in this administration; however, we must not overlook the fact that democrats (to make it relevant to this discussion) are staunch sponsors of some of the most outrageous legislation relating to IP. (DMCA anyone?)

I would suggest that you reconsider the views of the LP and take a closer look at many of the same issues we all defend.
http://action.eff.org

And if you’re as much a champion of Term Limits as I am, you must get involved.
http://www.ustl.org/Get_Involved/get_involved.html

This message has been edited since its posting. Latest edit was made on 27 Nov 2006 @ 13:20

6027.11.2006 17:40
tedrehak
Inactive

Bloody greedy jews

6127.11.2006 17:45

tedrehak only if...only if..... (meaning only if it where that small a group trying to screw everything over)

6227.11.2006 19:55
Ballpyhon
Inactive

@JaiQwan
that article about blocking/restricting certain internet sites is rediculous!
As far as the U.S. goes it is not the people who control the elections, it is the corporations (via "donations/pay offs). Electoral colleges were designed for the purpose that in the "old days" not everyone could make it to the voting booth. Now you can vote via the mail, internet and other ways. remove the "Electoral collages" and see what direction the U.S. goes. popular vote VS. Electoral vote. to make this point as clear as day to you all, it is not about the politics, its about the Money. they say that laws are passed by the "people", but who represents the "people"? the politicians (who conveniently are funded by corporations, and taxes).

The world has grown out of control. there is no right, no wrong, only popular opinion (in other words, who has the most $$$).

almost forgot to mention, my comments about the electoral colleges VS. popular vote has been greatly ignored. just look at the 2000 elections. Kerry would have won via popular vote. meaning no operation Iraqi freedom, ect.

This message has been edited since its posting. Latest edit was made on 27 Nov 2006 @ 19:59

6327.11.2006 21:15
alphabit
Inactive

Al Gore ran in 2000. Kerry ran in 2004. Even if Kerry Won we would be there.

6428.11.2006 3:45

Ballpyhon YES YES YES!!!!!!!! ^^ sad aint it 0-o alphabit yes and no Bush and CO. had to go to Iraq because they wanted to and they always wanted to. If we had Kerry WE would not have Iraq but its a good 50/50 we would be knee deep in the congo/darfour trying to sort that mess out as well as have the welcoming of the poor poor people from mexico so they can be the new slave class,sure the dems would have raised taxs and balanced that out by uping min wage and do soemthign abotu health care,I lean dem but fck as the part is right now tis a headless chicken wondering around looking for tis head the fundies and corporate Nazis run the reps there is no "balance" in goverment just various shades of gray...

6528.11.2006 5:29

I doubt it is possible for them to win, because MP3 Players and phones alike are like CD players, and we dont tax them. So I think their argument is Nil.

6628.11.2006 6:38
Ballpyhon
Inactive

@ alphabit- I had a lot going on when i wrote that. thanks for correcting me. @denbost- I have said before some where on the forums about boycotting all Media, have one person buy the media (one copy of each) and upload the rest to the world. how long would M$, Apple, Hollywood, corporate millionaires and the like survive on $1000.00? About as long as I can.

6729.11.2006 5:00
JaiQwan
Inactive

Ballpyhon: I can’t agree with you more, and seeing as how the people have so many avenues to make their votes count, my and so many others question is why do people not exercise these options? I few months back prier to the NJ state senate elections, the local paper published statistics showing how many people just simple do not vote! Why is beyond me and yet these are people who complain the most and at how unhappy they are. It is like the sheep being led to the slaughter and yet they do nothing about it but complain and cry the blues. And as to my earlier post, when I stated (the US Of A) I should have said the (the Big Corporations that are feeding the Hungary politicians with all the cold hard CASH they can) are trying to control the Internet, And those Corporations are the Big Phone companies that never wanted anything to do with the Internet way back when. But now they see what they have all missed out on and now want to control it, only to make more $$$$ by charging people like you and me to simply use the internet. Don't we pay enough already with sky rocketing price’s as it is, If it is not one of the Phone companies, then it is the cable companies, or as to the topic of this thread, the Music companies. Where does it ever end? Or does it?

6829.11.2006 17:41

certainly its about money; money to help the politicians keep their jobs, and they will take it from anybody (even you). They also know that you will have forgotten what they did to you in a couple of weeks. Let them know that they have lost your vote and remember when the time comes. Ballpyhon suggests getting rid of the electorial college; it was put in place to discourage tyranny by the majority. Think if there was a "world order" the the powers want and if a majority ruled "you would have to live your life as a good chinese peasant. If you think that is far fetched, look at the cities and states that have passed laws by the majority governing what you can do in your own property i.e. no smoking, no cooking with lard etc.

6929.11.2006 17:55

alvinm I am torn abotu smokeign its evil yet its a "right",the whole lard thing should go tho. I however see no reason to ban Pot when tis better than Booze when you dont smoke it weekly,great for smokers with canser (like my mom was) if she had it she could have ate and doubled her chances at survivail. Insted locking her away in home to die how is that cheaper and better? >< Corporations are blind sided by greed and the gverment is supposed to protect the people not sit at the trafe feeding their fat little bellys...

7029.11.2006 18:33

well whats next house and car steros and just think you can thank bill gates for this shit,and as far as levys go I bet the Finnish government get a nice cut for them selfs greedy fuckheads,

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