AfterDawn: Tech news

Fox to release first Blu-ray title with "picture-in-picture interactivity"

Written by Andre Yoskowitz (Google+) @ 29 Oct 2007 23:12 User comments (25)

Fox to release first Blu-ray title with "picture-in-picture interactivity" 20th Century Fox Home Entertainment has said that it will become the first studio to release a movie on Blu-ray with picture-in-picture interactivity when it releases the thriller "Sunshine" in January.
Fox showed off the title's P-I-P features which included the filmmakers talking about "the making of the film in a separate video stream that runs concurrently with the movie."

Mostly all current Blu-ray players cannot play back P-I-P features although all HD DVD players have the ability to do so.

Fox senior VP Steve Feldstein did note however that a few players were coming to the market that include P-I-P playback. “There will be players in the market,” Feldstein said.

Sony is expected to soon update the PlayStation 3 to have P-I-P playback via a firmware update and the upcoming Samsung dual-format player should be able to playback the feature by the end of January.

All Blu-ray players launched after October 31st must be capable of playing P-I-P as mandated by the Blu-ray Disc Association.

Source:
VideoBusiness

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25 user comments

130.10.2007 8:21
nobrainer
Inactive

great this picture in picture feature will defiantly make me go out and purchase sony's DRM (AACD, BD+, SPDC) laden propertarian bloated format. will the pip include the ip locations that the blu-ray is phoning home to i wonder or is that still buried in all the small print?

230.10.2007 11:16

uh oh, hear that? here comes high jars on hd dvd's defence...and on blu rays attack!

330.10.2007 11:35
hughjars
Inactive

What's to defend and what's to attack?

Blu-ray are offering the same level of interactivity as you can find on a CD ROM and fake PiP.

Still no sign of 'profile 1.1' or 'profile 2.0' in either hardware or software.

Absolutely nothing to justify the term 'advanced features', eh?

430.10.2007 11:38

Originally posted by nobrainer:
great this picture in picture feature will defiantly make me go out and purchase sony's DRM (AACD, BD+, SPDC) laden propertarian bloated format. will the pip include the ip locations that the blu-ray is phoning home to i wonder or is that still buried in all the small print?
told you!

530.10.2007 12:48
duckNrun
Inactive

This is EXCELLENT! I've been waiting for some feature to arrive that would take up screen space of the movie I am watching and crowd out the movie dialogue with some guy talking about HOW the movie was made.. I mean who wants to watch a movie when you watch some director or actor TALKING about the movie instead!

If I wanted to see this crap I can do it already on standard DVDs.

630.10.2007 12:52

Search the web: apparently BD+ has been cracked by SlySoft!

730.10.2007 13:03
morguex
Inactive

First off it's "hughjars"
And from the posts i've seen him make in the past, he's one of the few people in here that make anysense most of the time.

Peace all

830.10.2007 13:08

woops forgive my mispell, yeah he makes lots of sense all right. like that guy rob enderle and his 'unbiased' articles.

930.10.2007 13:21

Quote:
Originally posted by nobrainer:
great this picture in picture feature will defiantly make me go out and purchase sony's DRM (AACD, BD+, SPDC) laden propertarian bloated format. will the pip include the ip locations that the blu-ray is phoning home to i wonder or is that still buried in all the small print?
told you!
Ok first off, you didnt even quote hughjars so you embarrass yourself...and second if i continue to see people taking personal shots at hughjars or anyone else, especially if you arent contributing anything otherwise, you will be getting banned. Im tired of reading that type of junk in my news articles.

1030.10.2007 16:27

Originally posted by hughjars:
What's to defend and what's to attack?

Blu-ray are offering the same level of interactivity as you can find on a CD ROM and fake PiP.

Still no sign of 'profile 1.1' or 'profile 2.0' in either hardware or software.

Absolutely nothing to justify the term 'advanced features', eh?

Fox Plans Profile 1.1 'Sunshine' Blu-ray For Q1 2008


http://www.highdefdigest.com/news/show/D...or_Q1_2008/1118

Theres your answer right there but who really cares about advance menus ?Just give people great HiDef movie transfers thats all they want not extras people didn't care on DVD & not going to care on either HD format.

F.Y.I looks like there going to be a end coming soon to this Format War looks like Warner is going Blu-Ray exclusive.


Warner Mulls Change in High-Def Strategy

http://www.highdefdigest.com/news/show/W...f_Strategy/1123


Quote:
"One thing that may be changing is our strategy," he said. "When both formats launched and hardware prices were high, we made a decision to support both formats and let the consumer decide. But now that hardware pricing is affordable for both Blu-ray and HD DVD, it appears consumers no longer want to decide — so the notion of staying in two formats for the duration is something we are re-evaluating now that we are in the fourth quarter."

Silverberg went on to emphasize the Warner's strong Blu-ray sales, noting that the studio's Blu-ray release of '300' is the format's top selling disc. "We can definitely talk Blu-ray," said Silverberg. "We are committed to the format."
Looks like a lot of studios are doing a lot of re-evaluation.First Weinstein now Warner also New Line is having issues with HD-DVD because there is no region coding therefore all HD-DVD titles world wide are being moved back due to the fact some movie not being released in theaters.If Warner goes BD exclusive we all know that this format war is over.
This message has been edited since its posting. Latest edit was made on 30 Oct 2007 @ 17:25

1130.10.2007 17:17
goodswipe
Inactive

It's a funny thing, I've been a member of Afterdawn since 2003. I only post here and there, don't cause to much of a fuss on some topics, just soak up what I'm reading. I love to read all of the user coments. Just recently I ran across an article where everyone was commenting on this certain member hughjar, given that I hadn't been to Afterdawn in quite some time, I had no idea who these people were referring to. Then as I scrolled a ways down..there it was, a post by HUGHJAR, and it was at that time that I knew who this person was. Now when I read anything regarding or in reference to HD-DVD or Blueray, or just the simple discussion of 1080i vs 1080p, I know soon hughjars will be there to leave his two cents in regards to the matter and leave me full of non-stop laughs... I love that guy and I know all of you do as well.

1230.10.2007 17:25
hughjars
Inactive

Originally posted by nextgen76:
Fox Plans Profile 1.1 'Sunshine' Blu-ray For Q1 2008
- ....and this is, um, how many times they have announced 'plans'?

The 'profile 1.1' hardware's not going too well is it?
There only are 2 (delayed) 'profile 1.1' players.

They do keep hinting that the PS3 might get some additional features & get upgraded to bring it close to 'profile 1.1' or 'profile 2.0' but never quite claim it will be the full deal (which if it really were possible you can bet they would have shouted from the roof-tops from day 1).

They all had plans to have 'profile 1.1' mandatory in May/June 2007, then the end of Oct and now it's been reduced to a matter of being 'profile 1.1 compliant via a firmware update' sometime, maybe, in 2008 at an unspecified date for the (delayed) Samsung BDP5000.
The (delayed) Denon is merely supposed to be 'profile 1.1' compliant in late spring/summer 2008 when (if) it appears.

Provided nothing gets delayed, again.

.....and after the 'success' of BD+ I wouldn't expect anything but a low key test to start with for the software.
I'd lay money on hardly any 'profile 1.1' titles for a long long time.

Denon already said (a month or two ago) that they were still "working hard" to get 'profile 1.0' players and discs to work properly with 'profile 1.1' players and discs.

.....and is this really what that fuss over the 50gbs size was all about?
'Features' no better than an interactive CD and a fake PiP system (where the disc has 2 complete(!?) movie tracks, one normal and the other with the faked PiP)?
That's really not very impressive at all.

Originally posted by nextgen76:
here going to be a end coming soon to this Format War looks like Warner is going Blu-Ray exclusive.
- Actually read the article properly.

It's actually extremely vague & does not say what you want it to say.

In fact in view of the known higher costs of Blu-ray production if I were you I'd be worried that they are more likely to go HD DVD exclusive and dump Blu-ray just like Viacom/Paramount did.

Warner will be deciding in 2008.

My bet is an announcement at CES in Jan after they get the data about how things went over Q4 up to & including X-mas.

The Venturer, Toshiba HD A2 & HD A3 $149/169/198 deals will be the key.
This message has been edited since its posting. Latest edit was made on 30 Oct 2007 @ 17:59

1330.10.2007 17:42
goodswipe
Inactive

Yea, I would have to agree with hughjars on that one. I think the cost of the media will have a huge deciding factor as to what format these companies go with.

1430.10.2007 17:57

Found that link to AnyDVD cracking the latest AACS... so what's next Sony? (edit: it wasn't BD+... yet!)

http://www.cdrinfo.com/Sections/News/Details.aspx?NewsId=21709

This message has been edited since its posting. Latest edit was made on 30 Oct 2007 @ 17:58

1530.10.2007 18:00

Originally posted by nobrainer:
great this picture in picture feature will defiantly make me go out and purchase sony's DRM (AACD, BD+, SPDC) laden propertarian bloated format. will the pip include the ip locations that the blu-ray is phoning home to i wonder or is that still buried in all the small print?
Quote:
"All that AACS-LA has to offer now is BD+, but even that is on the verge of being circumvented and a release is expected by the end of this year," said Slysoft.

BD+ is a content code that interacts with the Virtual Machine found on Blu-Ray players and decides whether the player is hacked. According to the BDA, to successfully attack the BD+ system, pirates would have to overcome the AV content security system (e.g. extract AACS keys) and also overcome title-specific security code (e.g. reverse engineer security code). But until now, it is uncertain whether this title-specific security code (BD+ content code) will be included by Studios on a title-by-title basis. In that case, breaking the whole protection scheme would be more complicated.

James Wong, Head of development at SlySoft: "We already found a way to crack BD+ and we have just turned to fine-tuning. I should really think about hiring a bodyguard now, since this product won't please everybody."
http://www.cdrinfo.com/Sections/News/Details.aspx?NewsId=21709

This is why i never worry about copy protection or over react about it.

1630.10.2007 18:08
hughjars
Inactive

Originally posted by nextgen76:
This is why i never worry about copy protection or over react about it.
- Er, the problem with 'copy protection'/'security'/'DRM' is far more than a mere matter of cracking for ripping discs.

It's about things like compatability issues and problems paying-punters have with using (all) the kit they own the way they want to use it.

This has never just been about whether Blu-ray discs could be copied, it is about the inconvenience & impact of those so-called 'security measures' on you using your own kit.

You might not care about a world of constant patches and updates (for your bl**dy DVD player and/or any related programs in connection with it, ffs) but it will be a nightmare for many, especially the less technically minded......oh and it's still not actually been broken yet either.
This message has been edited since its posting. Latest edit was made on 30 Oct 2007 @ 18:10

1730.10.2007 18:12

Quote:
Originally posted by nextgen76:
This is why i never worry about copy protection or over react about it.
- Er, the problem with 'copy protection'/'security'/'DRM' is far more than a mere matter of cracking for ripping discs.

It's about things like compatability issues and problems paying-punters have with using (all) the kit they own the way they want to use it.

This has never just been about whether Blu-ray discs could be copied, it is about the inconvenience & impact of those so-called 'security measures' on you using your own kit.

You might not care about a world of constant patches and updates (for your bl**dy DVD player and/or any related programs in connection with it, ffs) but it will be a nightmare for many, especially the less technically minded......oh and it's still not actually been broken yet either.

BD+ is the name given to an experimental Digital Rights Management (DRM) mechanism that will be included on BD-ROM discs. The Blu-ray Disc Association was forced into providing this extra layer of protection following pressure from Fox. The HD DVD group did not agree to provide Fox with such a DRM over AACS. The fears about BD+ surround the possibility of studios like Fox theoretically being given the power to restrict Mandatory Managed Copy (a system that allows users to make digital copies of movies and send them around a home network).

BD+ allows for dynamic encryption schemes, meaning that if the protection were to be cracked, manufacturers could simply change the encryption scheme on new discs, so on single crack could not open up all BD-ROM discs. This is, of course a major advantage over the Content Scrambling System (CSS) protection used on DVD discs which was cracked years ago. All old and new DVDs containing CSS can be ripped from the disc to a HDD, or software is available to simply remove CSS on-the-fly.

1830.10.2007 20:42

Id rather watch the movie without some dumbbell director talking over it.

1930.10.2007 21:22

I agree with some of the other posts here that pip and web interactivity
do not interest me in the slightest. It's rare to find a movie worth watching twice these days much less all the other crap included. Give me the best least compressed picture and audio quality transfer you can get and leave the rest out.

2030.10.2007 21:25

Quote:
- Actually read the article properly.

It's actually extremely vague & does not say what you want it to say.

In fact in view of the known higher costs of Blu-ray production if I were you I'd be worried that they are more likely to go HD DVD exclusive and dump Blu-ray just like Viacom/Paramount did.
Warner will be deciding in 2008.

The format war is far from over, i's true but i'm not worried about Warner dropping blu ray when all of their titles sell more on blu ray than on HD-DVD, most notably "300" despite te added extras etc of the HD-DVD version. Things may yet change, we will see.

2131.10.2007 9:27
hughjars
Inactive

Originally posted by domie:
i'm not worried about Warner dropping blu ray when all of their titles sell more on blu ray than on HD-DVD, most notably "300" despite te added extras etc of the HD-DVD version.
- Yeah ok but this comes back to what Viacom/Paramount said, the additional sales are offset by Blu-ray's higher production costs to the point where they don't cover those costs.

Originally posted by domie:
Things may yet change, we will see.
- Jan 2008.
After the data for Q4 emerges.

That is when it's going to happen
(and there are those who were at CEDIA who are saying the deal has already been done & Warner will be going HD DVD exclusive).

2231.10.2007 16:08

Quote:
Quote:
- Actually read the article properly.

It's actually extremely vague & does not say what you want it to say.

In fact in view of the known higher costs of Blu-ray production if I were you I'd be worried that they are more likely to go HD DVD exclusive and dump Blu-ray just like Viacom/Paramount did.
Warner will be deciding in 2008.

The format war is far from over, i's true but i'm not worried about Warner dropping blu ray when all of their titles sell more on blu ray than on HD-DVD, most notably "300" despite te added extras etc of the HD-DVD version. Things may yet change, we will see.

Oh no the word is that HD-DVD going to be dropped from Warner due to Blu-Ray strong sales the whole year not once did HD-DVD out sell Blu-Ray this year plus Warner has sold more Blu-Ray than HD-DVD.Not even with Transformer,Blu-Ray still outsold HD-DVD that week also without even launching a major title.With Spider-man 3 launching yesterday your going to see stronger sales numbers this week.

Here is a link to Amazon so you can see that Blu-Ray has out sold HD-DVD this whole year.

http://www.eproductwars.com/dvd/

2331.10.2007 16:42

picture in picture is a nice additional feature for Blu-rays. I hope more movies will use that feature in a smart way from now on.

2431.10.2007 17:06
hughjars
Inactive

Originally posted by nextgen76:
Oh no the word is that HD-DVD going to be dropped
- No it isn't.

There has just been a 2 day Blu-ray beano from which a few (highly ambiguous) comments have emerged and which the Blu-ray fanclub claim might mean Warner going their way.

There are no direct quotes and nothing which remotely resembles a hint that Warner are going Blu-ray exclusive.

The comment was that they were looking at their dual format status.

That was it.

.....and if what Viacom/Paramount have said about costs is true (and we do in fact see an excellent Q4 for HD DVD) then in fact just the opposite may be true and Warner may well go HD DVD exclusive.

Originally posted by nextgen76:
due to Blu-Ray strong sales the whole year
- "Strong sales"!?

With total sales at under 4% of the total movie disc market?

You're just fooling yourself with that sort of comment.

The truth is that the market is too tiny to be so definitive.

You're also continually ignoring the matter of costs.

Viacom/Paramount said loud and clear that those additional sales (compared to HD DVD) were offset by the additional costs Blu-ray imposes.

Originally posted by nextgen76:
not once did HD-DVD out sell Blu-Ray this year plus Warner has sold more Blu-Ray than HD-DVD.Not even with Transformer
- Yeah well when you have 10 - 20 times the number of players out there (that's counting all the PS3s as Blu-ray players for all the Sony/PS3/Blu-ray fans who get their knickers in a twist over the stand-alone stats) and you have to go for 'buy one get one free' promotions and can still only just beat out the competition (which you've been claiming is "dead" or "dying" all year) you know something is really up.

Originally posted by nextgen76:
Blu-Ray still outsold HD-DVD that week also without even launching a major title.
- 'Blu-ray' have spent all year supposedly launching supposedly 'killer' titles and yet still HD DVD has closed the gap.

Originally posted by nextgen76:
With Spider-man 3 launching yesterday your going to see stronger sales numbers this week.
- Spiderman 3 might take the record from Transformers, by a small margin (it being a genuinely awful movie).....and what?

10 - 20 times the numbers of Blu-ray players will give a slighter better total.
Big deal.

The studios are watching attachment rates.

They can see the poor performance the PS3 is having at shifting Blu-ray movies (cos lets face it without PS3 Blu-ray died and was buried long ago).

They can also see the HD DVD stand-alones sustaining growing HD DVD retail sales, despite several supposedly 'blockbuster' movies from the Blu-ray side this year and yet still they are closing the gap.

It is HD DVD that is growing in market share and Blu-ray that is losing market share right now.

2511.11.2007 16:00

I think i have seen this feature in an old die another day bond DVD movie that had this feature i think.

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