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Election Hacking: Obama orders review of cyber attacks, foreign interference

Written by James Delahunty (Google+) @ 09 Dec 2016 14:51 User comments (31)

Election Hacking: Obama orders review of cyber attacks, foreign interference U.S. President Barack Obama has ordered intelligence agencies to conduct a full review of cyber attacks and foreign interference in the run up to the Presidential election.
In October, the U.S. Intelligence Community (USIC) accused the Russian government of directing the compromise of e-mails belonging to U.S. persons and institutions, with the hacking of the Democratic National Committee (DNC) being the most significant breach.

The hacked information made its way to several organizations, including Wikileaks, and then was published for public consumption.

Lisa Monaco, Obama's homeland security adviser, said the President has made it clear he wants the report to be completed and presented before he leaves office on January 20, 2017.

"The president has directed the intelligence community to conduct a full review of what happened during the 2016 election process ... and to capture lessons learned from that and to report to a range of stakeholders, to include the Congress," Monaco said, reports the Reuters News Agency.

This is not the first time that a Presidential election has been subject to such attacks. In 2008, the campaigns of both then-Senator Barack Obama, and Senator John McCain, were subject to cyber attacks believed to have originated in China.

Sources & Recommended Reading:
Obama orders review of 2016 election cyber attacks: www.reuters.com
Homeland Security Statement on Russian Hacking, October 2016: www.dhs.gov
Image Source: www.whitehouse.gov (Photo by Pete Souza)

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31 user comments

19.12.2016 17:44

Trump said the elections were rigged, now he has won does he still think that?


shit doesnt just happen theres always an arsehole involved

29.12.2016 20:53
hearme0
Inactive

You know we're in deep shit when the very president that we JUST ELECTED (technically no cause Hillary was 3+ million more in the popular vote which is FACT), adamantly DENIES that Russia had anything to do with any hacking attempt throughout this election process while the FBI has PROOF that the hacks came from 8 IP addresses from the "King Servers" which are fairly well known server farms owned and operated by Russian people, an 18 yr old specifically, and majority located in Russian territories.


Phew! That was a mouthful.


Putin is another Hitler......plain and simple!

This message has been edited since its posting. Latest edit was made on 09 Dec 2016 @ 20:57

39.12.2016 21:54

Trump was right, the elections are rigged, and he was in on it! In the meantime the majority who voted against him are expected to accept President "Pussy Grabber" as our leader. A leader who can't seem to avoid getting into petty squabbles on Twitter. Putin's goal is to paint Russian in a more favorable light, while at the same time working to destabilize other western democracies. If a foreign nation under despots such as Putin can affect the election of the U.S, then no nation in the free world is safe.


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410.12.2016 11:52

Originally posted by hearme0:
You know we're in deep shit when the very president that we JUST ELECTED (technically no cause Hillary was 3+ million more in the popular vote which is FACT), adamantly DENIES that Russia had anything to do with any hacking attempt throughout this election process while the FBI has PROOF that the hacks came from 8 IP addresses from the "King Servers" which are fairly well known server farms owned and operated by Russian people, an 18 yr old specifically, and majority located in Russian territories.


Phew! That was a mouthful.


Putin is another Hitler......plain and simple!
If you check with America you will find that millions of illegals voted for Hillary so definitely not the most popular vote .Paper votes only could be trusted .Hillary could be prosecuted

510.12.2016 12:00

Quote:
If you check with America you will find that millions of illegals voted for Hillary so definitely not the most popular vote .Paper votes only could be trusted .Hillary could be prosecuted
And if you check with a little thing known as the facts, you will discover that in spite of efforts to prove illegals voted in the election, there is zero evidence to support the claim.

http://www.factcheck.org/2016/10/trumps...r-fraud-claims/
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611.12.2016 7:30

A tempus in a teapot... by Russians,... they mean inspired young hackers like Snowden... but not on the Russian pay roll I'm sure.we need them to survive this white out snow job were getting.


Bruce Frank

711.12.2016 14:02

Quote:
but not on the Russian pay roll I'm sure.
On that point we're in disagreement! I firmly believe that Putin directed the DNC hacks with the sole purpose of tipping the election. I also believe that Putin is engaged in efforts to destabilize Western Democracies which includes any member of the NATO Alliance. At the same time Putin helped create RT TV with the purpose of painting Russia in a more positive light. That makes this a far greater concern than just a "tempest in a teapot."
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811.12.2016 15:34

Originally posted by Sophocles:
Quote:
If you check with America you will find that millions of illegals voted for Hillary so definitely not the most popular vote .Paper votes only could be trusted .Hillary could be prosecuted
And if you check with a little thing known as the facts, you will discover that in spite of efforts to prove illegals voted in the election, there is zero evidence to support the claim.

http://www.factcheck.org/2016/10/trumps...r-fraud-claims/
the Real facts say different as you will see shortly UNLESS the media again try to obey orders and hide them.CNN has already been exposed as sending out Fake News.

911.12.2016 16:36

Originally posted by johncolxt:
Originally posted by hearme0:
You know we're in deep shit when the very president that we JUST ELECTED (technically no cause Hillary was 3+ million more in the popular vote which is FACT), adamantly DENIES that Russia had anything to do with any hacking attempt throughout this election process while the FBI has PROOF that the hacks came from 8 IP addresses from the "King Servers" which are fairly well known server farms owned and operated by Russian people, an 18 yr old specifically, and majority located in Russian territories.


Phew! That was a mouthful.


Putin is another Hitler......plain and simple!
If you check with America you will find that millions of illegals voted for Hillary so definitely not the most popular vote .Paper votes only could be trusted .Hillary could be prosecuted
Where's your source?

1011.12.2016 16:37

Quote:
the Real facts say different as you will see shortly UNLESS the media again try to obey orders and hide them.CNN has already been exposed as sending out Fake News.
Nonsense! The CIA released a report verifying Russia as the source of the hacks. CNN isn't the only news agency to report on it so unless you believe that CNN, The Washington Post, New York Times, USA Today, and several other news outlets are all in collusion, which is ludicrous, then those are the "real facts." By the way "FactCheck.org has good reputation for getting things right! So if you think they're all wrong, then you're probably a Trump supporter, which should mean you'll believe anything if you bought his tales.

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1111.12.2016 16:46

Originally posted by nu2duo:
Originally posted by johncolxt:
Originally posted by hearme0:
You know we're in deep shit when the very president that we JUST ELECTED (technically no cause Hillary was 3+ million more in the popular vote which is FACT), adamantly DENIES that Russia had anything to do with any hacking attempt throughout this election process while the FBI has PROOF that the hacks came from 8 IP addresses from the "King Servers" which are fairly well known server farms owned and operated by Russian people, an 18 yr old specifically, and majority located in Russian territories.


Phew! That was a mouthful.


Putin is another Hitler......plain and simple!
If you check with America you will find that millions of illegals voted for Hillary so definitely not the most popular vote .Paper votes only could be trusted .Hillary could be prosecuted
Where's your source?

Is the source you're looking for the final vote tally? If so then here they are. Clinton thus far has 65,737,041 and Trump has 62,896,704, which means that Clinton beat Trump in the popular vote by 2,840,337. So the claim that Clinton beat Trump by 2.5 million is actually less than the actual total of 2.84 million.

http://uselectionatlas.org/RESULTS/national.php

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1211.12.2016 17:04

Originally posted by Sophocles:


If you check with America you will find that millions of illegals voted for Hillary so definitely not the most popular vote .Paper votes only could be trusted .Hillary could be prosecuted
Ahh, another ignorant Trump supporter........You people really are a sorry bunch.

1311.12.2016 17:58

Originally posted by ivymike:
Originally posted by Sophocles:


If you check with America you will find that millions of illegals voted for Hillary so definitely not the most popular vote .Paper votes only could be trusted .Hillary could be prosecuted
Ahh, another ignorant Trump supporter........You people really are a sorry bunch.
I don,t like lies and Hillary is a Liar ,big investigation underway I hear.latest news states More American news channels have been caught out ,starting with MSNBC. We will have to wait and see .Ahh, another Hillary supporter and ignorant ,best to stay in between the two camps.
Bye for now until 2017

1411.12.2016 18:03

Originally posted by Sophocles:
Quote:
but not on the Russian pay roll I'm sure.
On that point we're in disagreement! I firmly believe that Putin directed the DNC hacks with the sole purpose of tipping the election. I also believe that Putin is engaged in efforts to destabilize Western Democracies which includes any member of the NATO Alliance. At the same time Putin helped create RT TV with the purpose of painting Russia in a more positive light. That makes this a far greater concern than just a "tempest in a teapot."
To be fair, the FBI said that the RNC was also hacked by (most likely) the same people...it's just that the RNC was better about email security, and they don't seem to have rigged their own primaries (if they had, wouldn't they have picked ANYONE else?). Also, you really can't blame any foreign influence for Trump winning when the DNC intentionally lost by sabotaging their better candidate. It was pretty obvious even before anyone imagined Trump would be a contender than Clinton didn't stand a chance in a general election; the only reason she ended up doing as well as she did is that Trump shouldn't have had a chance either. Trump won mainly because he isn't an insider (and because he didn't intentionally take on the NRA for no reason); put against Sanders he would have lost by huge numbers.

As for who won the popular vote, it doesn't matter...trump is not the first to win the electoral vote without the popular vote; that's how the system is designed and considering the fact that places where it devalues votes the most (like California) have never done anything about it, it will likely happen again.

1511.12.2016 18:06

Originally posted by johncolxt:
Originally posted by ivymike:
Originally posted by Sophocles:


If you check with America you will find that millions of illegals voted for Hillary so definitely not the most popular vote .Paper votes only could be trusted .Hillary could be prosecuted
Ahh, another ignorant Trump supporter........You people really are a sorry bunch.
I don,t like lies and Hillary is a Liar ,big investigation underway I hear.latest news states More American news channels have been caught out ,starting with MSNBC. We will have to wait and see .Ahh, another Hillary supporter and ignorant ,best to stay in between the two camps.
Bye for now until 2017
And Trump is not (a liar)!?! You're a special kind of stupid.

Go back to your Fox News....
This message has been edited since its posting. Latest edit was made on 11 Dec 2016 @ 18:22

1611.12.2016 19:51

Quote:
To be fair, the FBI said that the RNC was also hacked by (most likely) the same people
I don't know where you came by your information but it's false, and email security has nothing to do with it. All the security in the world can't prevent a good hacker from getting through at some point. Trump isn't a better candidate, he's a psychopath, a modern Jim Jones, and you've bought into his cult.

Quote:
As for who won the popular vote, it doesn't matter.
Yes it does matter, because that means that more American voted against him than those who voted for him. Republicans blocked Obama in all 8 years of his two terms in office, and Obama won both terms decisively. Trump on the other suffered the greatest popular vote loss in U.S history of any Electoral College winner. So those of us on the left will fight Trump every inch of the way, and unlike Mitch McConnell's failed efforts to make Obama a 1 term president, we're going to succeed in insuring that Trump serves a single term.

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1711.12.2016 19:57

Quote:
And Trump is not (a liar)!?! You're a special kind of stupid.

Politifact found that Trump lied in 71% of all his claims vs Clinton's 26%. Hell I've caught dozens of his lies and even made YouTube videos of him contradicting himself. So let me reiterate, Trump is not just a liar, he's a compulsive serial liar, and you fools accepted his lies without question while insisting that the actual truths are the lies. In the meantime you probably need an instruction manual to help you remove lint from your bellybutton. ;-)

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1812.12.2016 0:44

Originally posted by Sophocles:
Quote:
To be fair, the FBI said that the RNC was also hacked by (most likely) the same people
I don't know where you came by your information but it's false, and email security has nothing to do with it. All the security in the world can't prevent a good hacker from getting through at some point. Trump isn't a better candidate, he's a psychopath, a modern Jim Jones, and you've bought into his cult.

Quote:
As for who won the popular vote, it doesn't matter.
Yes it does matter, because that means that more American voted against him than those who voted for him. Republicans blocked Obama in all 8 years of his two terms in office, and Obama won both terms decisively. Trump on the other suffered the greatest popular vote loss in U.S history of any Electoral College winner. So those of us on the left will fight Trump every inch of the way, and unlike Mitch McConnell's failed efforts to make Obama a 1 term president, we're going to succeed in insuring that Trump serves a single term.
IF you are saying I'm a trump supporter, I consider that an insult. If you were not so brainwashed, you might have noticed that I actually said Sanders deserved to win. I am simply stating the facts...the RNC was either better about security, better about not saying damning things in emails, or both. As for Clinton herself, her entire defense in that whole email probe is that she was too old and ignorant to do proper email security AS REQUIRED BY LAW. That's her defense; the line CNBC and CNN ran with.

In some sense you are right...it matters that the country is divided by a choice between two terrible candidates that both ran on the platform of not being the other. It matters that our electoral system is an outdated relic of a time when people were more patriotic to their home states than to the USA, when most voters couldn't even read, and when the election date was based on rural farmers not having to travel on a Sunday (because it took a day or more to get to the poles). But the system is the system, they both agreed to the rules, and if Clinton had won the electoral vote while losing the popular vote you wouldn't be arguing that Trump should be president...you only argue the opposite because you wanted her to win and she did lose.

You want to block everything Trump attempts? For the most part I'm fine with that...I do think he is crazy enough to possibly end marijuana prohibition and I hope you would let him if the voices in his head tell him to do so, and given his history with women I wouldn't be too surprised to see him try to increase abortion rights in spite of his party...but otherwise...yeah...make his term in office meaningless. As a general rule that would be an improvement for any politician, from either party. Please do the same for the next president as well...no matter who they are.

BTW...trump may have gotten 2 percent less of the popular vote, but he got 12% more of the electoral vote; this wasn't even a close race. I don't like it either...but it is what it is; the DNC threw this race away. Maybe next time they will let Bernie win...assuming he isn't so fed up with it that he just moves to Canada.

1912.12.2016 9:48

Quote:
IF you are saying I'm a trump supporter, I consider that an insult. If you were not so brainwashed, you might have noticed that I actually said Sanders deserved to win.
You never said anything close to what you've just claimed in your post.

Quote:
Trump won mainly because he isn't an insider (and because he didn't intentionally take on the NRA for no reason); put against Sanders he would have lost by huge numbers.


Not only is your post riddled with falsities, but as you can see there is no mention of Sanders "deserving" anything. You did say that he would've won "big" but that's it. I was also a Bernie Sanders supporter right to the end, but I wasn't stupid enough to be a Bernie or Buster, and then cast a vote out of spite. And as for being brainwashed! The only brainwashed people in this election are those who believed all the scary fairy tales about the evils of Hillary Clinton, and then without question, believed all the lies told by Trump, a serial lying demagogue.

Quote:
RNC was either better about security, better about not saying damning things in emails, or both
The RNC was never targeted so no one really knows what their level of security is, and I challenge you to provide a single credible source to back that claim. Also it wasn't what was actually in Hillary's emails that hurt her, it was the false perception of their containing evidence of a crime given by James Comey.

" As for Clinton herself, her entire defense in that whole email probe is that she was too old and ignorant to do proper email security AS REQUIRED BY LAW."

I find the above statement humorous for a number of reasons. I don't recall Clinton ever using her age and ignorance as a defense for her having a private server, and as long as there are no classified documents on her server it's perfectly legal.

Condoleezza Rice and Colin Powell both received classified emails in their unsecured private email accounts, and no one questioned them. The Bush administration either lost or deleted millions of emails and no harm came to them.

"it matters that the country is divided by a choice between two terrible candidates"

That's a false equivalency that gives the impression that there's no difference between Trump and Clinton, because Clinton on her worst day, is better than Trump is on his best day. The country isn't just polarized and divided by choice, it's also divided by intellectual and educational levels. Trump's entire campaign was based on racism, hate, and false promises, because he offered no specifics on a platform or how he was going to lead. But his association with Steve Bannon and those who follow him was quite revealing.

Here is a post by a female Trump supporter on a YouTube Channel discussing a video of Rob Reiner.

Quote:
I see. All the Jews need here are Mexicans who have NO educations and an average IQ of 82, blacks who are 85 percent on welfare and who have average IQs in the 70s and a few liberal whites to pay for all it it. So since I never committed a crime and paid taxes all my life and have an IQ of 132 and do a whole lot of things to help people and give to charities and I paid $5 million in death taxes last year, I am evil, in the past, bad, horrible and need to die. I see. So Jewish of you. You pay the taxes for your wonderful new brown black nation.


Quote:
ou want to block everything Trump attempts? For the most part I'm fine with that...I do think he is crazy enough to possibly end marijuana prohibition
That's not going to happen under a Trump presidency because of his choice of cabinet members, most of whom are against pot legalization.


One last thought about the NRA! I support the 2nd Amendment as it is written, but the NRA doesn't. The NRA is being manipulated by the Armaments industry, the same industry that has kept us at war for more than 50 years. Every war the U.S has fought since WWII has been a war of choice. The NRA used to help make sensible gun laws, and two previous Supreme Courts backed the 2nd Amendment as it is written. The United States is a failing democracy and it's about time we own up to that fact, because we're now a nation governed by Plutocrats. Look at Russia, it's a nation governed entirely by Oligarchs of which Putin is one. The real concern is if Trump is trying to join the club.

https://youtu.be/8y06NSBBRtY
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2012.12.2016 14:48

The MSM has been lying to you for decades and yet many of you are still listening to them? Really? SMH

Russian hackers!! LMFAO!! All this shit was the result of in-fighting within our own government.

Turn off the TV!

2112.12.2016 16:35

Originally posted by skeil909:
The MSM has been lying to you for decades and yet many of you are still listening to them? Really? SMH

Russian hackers!! LMFAO!! All this shit was the result of in-fighting within our own government.

Turn off the TV!
So you believe that government agents such as the CIA can't trace IP address origins? Well I'm sorry to inform you that it's not that complicated, even when routed through Proxy Servers. You do know that every time you logon to AD, that your entire IP address is displayed to Admins, and maybe even the mods. If an attempt to hack an online account such as gmail ocurs, Google will not only inform you of the attempted attack, but they can also tell you from which country it originated. Obviously PC knowledge is not one of your skills!

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2213.12.2016 20:24

Originally posted by Sophocles:
So you believe that government agents such as the CIA can't trace IP address origins?
I started reading your first reply but you clearly don't follow the news (not even the left-leaning channels) so I stopped. First you said "you've bought into his cult" then you back up and say that me saying Bernie would have won big was somehow an endorsement of trump??? Want the news story about the RNC being hacked? Try a google search, ABC (maybe the most left-leaning network in the US) has the story. If you actually wanted to know anything you asked you could have just googled, you didn't so I guess you would rather be ignorant.

In this most recent post, you are dead wrong. I can easily make it look to the AD (or any other server) as if I am in one of dozens of countries, I can trick the BBC into thinking I'm in London with a couple mouse clicks (don't need to now that Top Gear is on Amazon of course). It generally isn't worth my bother...but then I don't hack email accounts. The CIA CANNOT trace a properly routed IP...not without the consent of every server that IP is routed through. They traced attacks to a server farm in Russia...they may have started there or that may have just been another stopping point; we may never know. Personally I think it probably started there, but I don't KNOW that, you don't KNOW that, the CIA doesn't KNOW that, and even ODNI doesn't consider it to be a fact (CIA is below ODNI BTW). What is clear is that another hack came from the same farm, targeting the RNC...but for whatever reason there was nothing worth giving to WikiLeaks.

2313.12.2016 20:53

Originally posted by Sophocles:
Quote:
And Trump is not (a liar)!?! You're a special kind of stupid.

Politifact found that Trump lied in 71% of all his claims vs Clinton's 26%. Hell I've caught dozens of his lies and even made YouTube videos of him contradicting himself. So let me reiterate, Trump is not just a liar, he's a compulsive serial liar, and you fools accepted his lies without question while insisting that the actual truths are the lies. In the meantime you probably need an instruction manual to help you remove lint from your bellybutton. ;-)
Agreed. I never said that Trump is not a liar. Quite the contrary. Check the context of the original posting.

I do have a problem with people who think he's "honest". Talk about people being gullible.


2413.12.2016 22:15

Quote:
I started reading your first reply but you clearly don't follow the news (not even the left-leaning channels) so I stopped.
Casting insults won't elevate your posts, but to answer your question, I'm a news Junky, but not necessarily a left leaning one. I follow the news to where ever it leads, and then I fact check everything to insure its accuracy.

Quote:
First you said "you've bought into his cult" then you back up and say that me saying Bernie would have won big was somehow an endorsement of trump???
No, what I said was that your account of what you'd said about Bernie in your previuos post wasn't the same as the actual post. I also never made any claim that you were somehow endorsing Trump, so perhaps you can ease your concern about my news consumption, and redirect it to just understanding what I'd in fact had written. I find it annoying when people attempt to put, so to speak, "words in my mouth." This is the second time over two separate posts that you've given a revisionist account of either what you'd written, or what you claim I'd written.

"In this most recent post, you are dead wrong. I can easily make it look to the AD (or any other server) as if I am in one of dozens of countries, I can trick the BBC into thinking I'm in London"

"The CIA CANNOT trace a properly routed IP.."

Except in highly fictionalized movies there is no such thing as a properly routed IP, just carefully routed, but it's still out in the opening. It's relatively easy for a trained hacker or savy PC tech to trace IP addresses when they're active even when routed through multiple proxy servers. One computer cannot link to another computer without an IP ID. Remember a hack is a two way communication attempting to enter on the sly. Let's just say that I have a little experience in those areas going all the way back to the late 90s. I'm certain that the CIA and the NSA are much better at it than I am, so I'm confident of their ability to trace an IP address to its source. When the CIA says they believe that Russians were involved, what they really mean is that they know as a fact that the Russians were involved. In fact if the Russian source used a government funded site then they can trace it back to that government site, but most like they used an offsite hack.

Quote:
even ODNI doesn't consider it to be a fact (CIA is below ODNI BTW). What is clear is that another hack came from the same farm,
Sorry but that's false, because the ODNI also agrees that the Russians were responsible for the hacks and has been since October 7, 2016. Perhaps you should get your news from where I get mine, right from the source.

Quote:
DIRECTOR OF NATIONAL INTELLIGENCE
WASHINGTON, DC 20511

October 07, 2016

Joint Statement from the Department of Homeland Security
and Office of the Director of National Intelligence
on Election Security

The U.S. Intelligence Community (USIC) is confident that the Russian Government directed the recent compromises of e-mails from US persons and institutions, including from US political organizations.
The ODNI doesn't dispute the fact that the CIA successfully traced the hacks back to Russia. The ODNI is only disputing the claims made by the CIA that the hacks were done for the intent of affecting the outcome of the election. I find that a little odd considering that all the hacks targeted politically connected organizations only through periods following a national election. I wouldn't be at all surprised if some political posturing isn't involved in the dispute.

One last thought, try to accurately quote me, and temper your use of language just a little.


https://www.dni.gov/index.php/newsroom/...urity-statement
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2516.12.2016 14:40

Originally posted by hearme0:
You know we're in deep shit when the very president that we JUST ELECTED (technically no cause Hillary was 3+ million more in the popular vote which is FACT), adamantly DENIES that Russia had anything to do with any hacking attempt throughout this election process while the FBI has PROOF that the hacks came from 8 IP addresses from the "King Servers" which are fairly well known server farms owned and operated by Russian people, an 18 yr old specifically, and majority located in Russian territories.


Phew! That was a mouthful.


Putin is another Hitler......plain and simple!
Do you really know who Hitler was and what he did?
Do you really know the history? I doubt it.

2616.12.2016 21:52

Originally posted by SergoT:
Originally posted by hearme0:
You know we're in deep shit when the very president that we JUST ELECTED (technically no cause Hillary was 3+ million more in the popular vote which is FACT), adamantly DENIES that Russia had anything to do with any hacking attempt throughout this election process while the FBI has PROOF that the hacks came from 8 IP addresses from the "King Servers" which are fairly well known server farms owned and operated by Russian people, an 18 yr old specifically, and majority located in Russian territories.


Phew! That was a mouthful.


Putin is another Hitler......plain and simple!
Do you really know who Hitler was and what he did?
Do you really know the history? I doubt it.
Thats what they are supposed to do... it's what we do... wake up get real...

Bruce Frank

2716.12.2016 22:06

Quote:
Thats what they are supposed to do... it's what we do... wake up get real...
You do know that your reply has absolutely no context whatsoever right?

Who are they, that's what they're supposed to do because it's what we do? You didn't include a single point of reference to what you were replying to. So how can one wake up and get real to gibberish?
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2818.12.2016 13:22

Originally posted by Sophocles:

Sorry but that's false, because the ODNI also agrees that the Russians were responsible for the hacks and has been since October 7, 2016. Perhaps you should get your news from where I get mine, right from the source.

If you read beyond the headlines you will see that the only "evidence" of russian government involvement is that people who did not work for the russian government but who are russian citizens happened to be involved (they think...but not enough proof for a court room). Remember this is the same government that said Iraq had weapons of mass destruction without a doubt based on what they thought without evidence, so you can't just trust what they put on the first page of a press release. At best we can say that it is very likely that the hacks either came from russian citizens or were protected by servers run by russian citizens (and yes, it is possible to make it look like a connection stops where it actually doesn't...we are talking about serious blackhats; they know their stuff better than a government that can't even unlock an iPhone). If the exact same thing happened in Canada we would be talking about those hackers from Canada; not saying that the Canadian government was responsible. It does seem likely that the Russian government would want Trump over Clinton and they are not above doing something like this, but it is irresponsible to claim that a foreign government with an arsenal of nuclear weapons is behind an attack when there is zero evidence to back it up...that's a great way to start WWIII.

The whole case against the russian government is circumstantial...and there is also circumstantial evidence to the contrary. The russian government can afford to fly people overseas, setup offices, internet, servers, etc in those foreign countries. If they were so concerned about things that they made their ties to these hackers impossible to find, why didn't they also provide funds to do the hacks from Ukraine, thus implicating a country they would love an excuse to invade? Why wold the government bother using resources hacking the RNC? Private hackers would do it just for the lulz. Also, julian assange came right out and said that they dumps did not come from a government...maybe you trust him, maybe not, maybe he was fooled but it's just another bit of circumstantial evidence against in a case built entirely of circumstantial evidence.

Given all that, you must admit that it is at least possible that non-government hackers did the job, just because they could (or because they personally disliked Clinton/liked Trump) (or because one of the many russian companies trump works with backed it instead)...just like non-government hackers broke the iPhone, broke the xbox, broke the ps3, root every Android that sells more than a few thousand copies, hack twitter accounts to make celebrities seem (more) crazy, etc. Clinton's missing emails were an international story for months and Trump actually asked the hacking community to find them. Every hacker in the world knew about them...why not target every email server she was likely to have sent or received messages from?

Again...if the exact same thing was done by Canadian hackers, NO ONE would claim the Canadian government was behind it because there is simply no evidence of government backing, only the assumption that the Russian government is trying to attack us. And yeah, that's probably true...but there isn't a shred of actual proof of that.

2918.12.2016 17:13

Originally posted by KillerBug:
Originally posted by Sophocles:

Sorry but that's false, because the ODNI also agrees that the Russians were responsible for the hacks and has been since October 7, 2016. Perhaps you should get your news from where I get mine, right from the source.

If you read beyond the headlines you will see that the only "evidence" of russian government involvement is that people who did not work for the russian government but who are russian citizens happened to be involved (they think...but not enough proof for a court room). Remember this is the same government that said Iraq had weapons of mass destruction without a doubt based on what they thought without evidence, so you can't just trust what they put on the first page of a press release. At best we can say that it is very likely that the hacks either came from russian citizens or were protected by servers run by russian citizens (and yes, it is possible to make it look like a connection stops where it actually doesn't...we are talking about serious blackhats; they know their stuff better than a government that can't even unlock an iPhone). If the exact same thing happened in Canada we would be talking about those hackers from Canada; not saying that the Canadian government was responsible. It does seem likely that the Russian government would want Trump over Clinton and they are not above doing something like this, but it is irresponsible to claim that a foreign government with an arsenal of nuclear weapons is behind an attack when there is zero evidence to back it up...that's a great way to start WWIII.

The whole case against the russian government is circumstantial...and there is also circumstantial evidence to the contrary. The russian government can afford to fly people overseas, setup offices, internet, servers, etc in those foreign countries. If they were so concerned about things that they made their ties to these hackers impossible to find, why didn't they also provide funds to do the hacks from Ukraine, thus implicating a country they would love an excuse to invade? Why wold the government bother using resources hacking the RNC? Private hackers would do it just for the lulz. Also, julian assange came right out and said that they dumps did not come from a government...maybe you trust him, maybe not, maybe he was fooled but it's just another bit of circumstantial evidence against in a case built entirely of circumstantial evidence.

Given all that, you must admit that it is at least possible that non-government hackers did the job, just because they could (or because they personally disliked Clinton/liked Trump) (or because one of the many russian companies trump works with backed it instead)...just like non-government hackers broke the iPhone, broke the xbox, broke the ps3, root every Android that sells more than a few thousand copies, hack twitter accounts to make celebrities seem (more) crazy, etc. Clinton's missing emails were an international story for months and Trump actually asked the hacking community to find them. Every hacker in the world knew about them...why not target every email server she was likely to have sent or received messages from?

Again...if the exact same thing was done by Canadian hackers, NO ONE would claim the Canadian government was behind it because there is simply no evidence of government backing, only the assumption that the Russian government is trying to attack us. And yeah, that's probably true...but there isn't a shred of actual proof of that.
This is the only line in the Joint statement because there were no headlines.

Quote:
The U.S. Intelligence Community (USIC) is confident that the Russian Government directed the recent compromises of e-mails from US persons and institutions, including from US political organizations.
Quote:
At best we can say that it is very likely that the hacks either came from russian citizens or were protected by servers run by russian citizens
No, at best the intelligence community said
Quote:
The U.S. Intelligence Community (USIC) is confident that the Russian Government directed the recent compromises of e-mails
with the key word being "confident."

Quote:
Remember this is the same government that said Iraq had weapons of mass destruction without a doubt based on what they thought without evidence
Actually it's a completely different government with different players. The United Nations stated that there were no WMD in Iraq, and the CIA knew it, but Bush and Cheney did a little creative revisionist doctoring to the info to make it support their private agenda. The CIA Deputy Director and intelligence briefer Michael Morell, has since come out and admitted that the so called intelligence was a lie.

This is a completely different set of circumstances, because it includes the entire U.S intelligence community, including the NSA who are among the best cyber sleuths on the planet. Since our last discussion a lot more information has surfaced that points directly to the Kremlin, and quite probably Putin himself. I've always been skeptical of the government. but never to the point where I would allow it to blind me to facts. There just too much evidence to write this off as some conspiracy theory. There's really no motive for the government to fudge the data because there's no benefit. So yes, the Russians did in fact hack into the DNC server and John Podesta's emails, a fact that both Republicans, minus Trump, and Democrats are in agreement on. There's going to be be a bipartisan investigation so let's leave it until then.





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3018.12.2016 23:34

I have yet to see any evidence...lots of "confidence" but from government officials that means nothing by itself. I did see a story where they were talking about how if the Russian government did the hacks then Putin would certainly be aware...except the hacks were traced to servers run by non-government hackers so it was basically just a bunch of filler material...old news and a bit of opinion but not a single new fact.

So yes, let's at least leave it until all the facts are actually in the open (or at least the ones that can be found). That's what I've been saying. If we just convicted people because the government said they did something, there would be no need for courts...and I doubt anyone would like that more than Trump (well, maybe Putin, Xi, and Kim...two of whom already have that).

3119.12.2016 9:09

Quote:
I have yet to see any evidence...lots of "confidence" but from government officials that means nothing by itself.
Mitch McConnell made an announcement condemning the Russians for the hacking of U.S. political organizations. At the end of the statement he mentioned that some details will not be released to the public to protect intelligence interests.

"Intelligence agencies have identified individuals with connections to the Russian government who provided WikiLeaks with thousands of hacked emails from the Democratic National Committee and others"

John McCain also announced that he too was convinced that the Russians hacked into the servers. So there really is no question that the hacks occurred or that the Russian government was involved. We will probably never know some details because they could threaten U.S intelligence secrets and or operatives. I doubt that an investigation is going to change the fact that the Russians were responsible for the hacks, but I would like to know more details.

"Please Read!!! Post your questions only in This Thread or they will go unanswered:

Help with development of BD RB: Donations at: http://www.jdobbs.com/
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