AfterDawn: Tech news

New copyright law approaches -- content to be removed

Written by Petteri Pyyny @ 26 Dec 2005 2:18 User comments (240)

New copyright law approaches -- content to be removed As some of you might remember, Finnish Parliament approved a new copyright legislation in October, 2005 and that new legislation will come into force on 1st of January, 2006. As AfterDawn Ltd is a company based in Finland, we have to play along with the new law, however vague and draconian it is.
We tried to find alternative solutions and have asked our lawyers to evaluate various options that would have allowed us to continue our operations as they used to be. Unfortunately, none of these options were solid enough to escape the new restrictions.

Thus, we've made our own analysis of the law and come to a conclusion that yes, we can continue running our site, but need to make some adjustments to the content. The law is extremely vague and leaves thousands of questions open, mostly leaving media corporations very free hands to sue whoever they wish to. Despite this, we decided to remove the content that most obviously violates the letter of the law, but decided to leave some breathing room for other areas.

The law has phrases like "Offering commercial services that allow circumventing technical copy protections ... is illegal." But doesn't provide any guidelines on what is considered to be "commercial" and what type of service the law is talking about. Our and our lawyers' analysis is that as we're a commercial company, having ads on our site, and providing guides -- written by our paid staff members -- and tools that help breaking protections like extremely weak CSS found on virtually all DVD-Video discs, we can be sued. And for those of you suggesting "move!", I can tell you that we evaluated that option with our lawyers as well and it would have required not just moving our company and servers, but all individuals involved with the site's day-to-day business as well.

Law also makes it illegal to distribute tools, even for free, that allow circumventing copy protections. However, in the reasong that the Ministry of Education submitted alongside the new law text to the Parliament, they stated that only tools whose main function is, or can be considered to be, to break copy protections, are illegal. Again, the text -- and the reasoning -- are extremely vague.

But as a summary, here are the changes that will take effect on 1st of January or shortly after that date:
  1. Forums
    • No changes. The law states that "organized discussion about breaking copy protections" will be illegal, but as nobody on our forums is planning to develop tools that break copy protections, we don't think it applies. Additionally, as everybody knows, our forums aren't exactly very organized ;-) And moderators aren't our staff members, our admins don't participate in threads discussing about how to break copy protection methods, ever.

  2. Guides
    • References how to use tools that allow circumventing copy protections will be removed
    • This means that guides converting AVIs to DVD, etc will remain intact.
    • This means that guides converting copy-protected DVDs to other formats will stay on our site, but the detailed instructions on how to use tools like DVD Decrypter, etc will be removed from those guides
    • Guides considering just how to break copy protections, will be removed (AFAIK, only one guide applies here)
  3. Software section
    • Major changes. All tools meant solely for DVD ripping and/or ripping copy-protected music CDs will be removed.
    • This is a major blow to us, as our site has one of the largest DVD ripping software collections on Earth. But the law is very clear with this one, tools like SmartRipper serve really only one main function -- ripping copy-protected DVDs -- and are therefore illegal from 1st of January, 2006.
  4. Other site areas
    • No changes. Stuff like glossary, FAQ section, etc will continue operating as they do now.

Yes, we know, this sucks. But stuff like relocating to other country doesn't work out, unless all of our staff moves there as well..

Additionally, we've decided to set the guides that need removal under the Creative Commons license that allows free distribution of the guides, providing that they aren't altered. The specific license can be read here. The list of guides that will be removed is:
  • Copy DVD to DVD-R using DVD Decrypter (DVDs smaller than 4.36GB)
  • Backing up a protected CD - an Alcohol 120% guide (not owned by AfterDawn Ltd, therefore this guide is not under Creative Commons license, but instead will be simply removed)
  • Copy DVD-9 to DVD-R using DVD X Copy XPRESS
  • Defeating Cactus Data Shield (not owned by AfterDawn Ltd, therefore this guide is not under Creative Commons license, but instead will be simply removed)
  • Bypassing DVD copy protections
  • Copy DVD to DVD-R using DVD Decrypter (DVDs smaller than 4.36GB) (the Finnish version of the guide)

And the list of guides that will be edited (please note that due various rights issues, these guides can't be distributed freely without our written permission and aren't licensed under Creative Commons license) in order to remove specific instructions on how to circumvent copy protections:
And here are the software tools that will be removed from our site on 1st of January, 2006:

That's it... Seems a rather long list, but then again, the two alternatives remaining were either to close the site or face upto 1 year in prison. We are currently supporting several campaigns in Finland that aim to amend the copyright legislation, but don't hold your breath on success, as it seems that the Ministry of Education and main parties have been fully brainwashed by large media corporations who are the only ones gaining something from this law.

In case you're interested, here are some of my personal thoughts about this law.

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240 user comments

126.12.2005 02:42

Get all the software now, before it gets removed

226.12.2005 03:08

Let's just leave it up to Brad Jolie and Angelina Pitt to save the world. I mean who needs a world with law and order when we have such fabulous people as these! I've been using this site for three years now and I must say I will sadly miss these tools and softwares. Thanks Afterdawn, for everything!

326.12.2005 04:36

This sucks but it could have been (a lot) worse.

426.12.2005 05:02

Will AnyDVD be available for purchase still? and what about updates?

526.12.2005 05:09


This message has been edited since its posting. Latest edit was made on 26 Dec 2005 @ 3:08

626.12.2005 05:11

YES,JUST KEEP THIS HTTP IN A PLACE WHEN YE CAN FIND IT as this law does not apply to slysoft anydvd web site and clonedvd

726.12.2005 05:17

This laws are just only to protect the Real Pirates, this is just "to try" stop individuals. There thousands ways to go to Rome... youll find one, keep working and be happy. Long live to Radified!!!

826.12.2005 06:06

wow this is one nice christmas present lol

926.12.2005 06:32

Jan 1 will be a sad day indeed - big multi million corporations trying to rule our lives. I just have 2 words for them and you can pretty much guess what they are. Yep it could have been worse - at least the forums are still going to be around. I'm still sticking around.

1026.12.2005 06:33

Well, look @ it the other way though, AfterDawn is a great site and still will be after Jan. 1; because AfterDawn is only removing that software from their site; not the whole internet! You can still get this stuff after Jan. 1 from P2P networks, or just do a google search!

1126.12.2005 06:34

ripping copy-protected music CDs will be removed.
What the hell!? This is annoys me beyond belief.. the fact that we can't discuss backing up music that we own!!! Looks like we're gonna have more visitors to our IRC channel ;) -Mike

1226.12.2005 06:35

Not to mention: there's still too!!!

1326.12.2005 06:40

Im sorry afterdawn. It's sad to see that large companies can just remove your content like that (I know you guys are being forced to remove it). I think this site can and will survive cause it's soo awesome. By the way what's happening with filepedia?

1426.12.2005 06:59

Wow, thats quite a large list. I am said to hear that this b@$t@rdish law has come upon the Finnish. I believe that laws such as this should not even exist. Here is why: Pirates, Hackers, Virus writers, etc. do NOT care about the law! As MANY of the news articles have pointed out here at aD: "scene groups" do NOT care about the law, all they care about is who can get the best "quality" (within the scene rules) copy of a movie, game, etc. released before other opposing groups do. Laws will NOT stop piracy, it always will exist as their will always be individuals that are willing to take the risk of getting caught! Sorry for a bit of ranting there, Peace, Pop Smith EDIT: By Pop_Smith for Grammar Errors

This message has been edited since its posting. Latest edit was made on 26 Dec 2005 @ 7:07

1526.12.2005 07:07

Yeah, there is no way to stop piracy.. it will continue to grow. -Mike

1626.12.2005 07:11

Im with pop there this seems as usless law as every other one that has been though for this.

1726.12.2005 07:13

I printed out a few of the guides that will be removed a while back. Good thing I decided to start learning this stuff before I found out the content was going to be removed. The guides provide alot of help and I haven't had problems burning.

1826.12.2005 07:20

I'm going to get what software/guides I've been putting off from lack of time to get,even ones I'm not going to need currently;who knows when they will come into use? Generally speaking this is a bunch of BS and I feel sorry for the community as a whole,that everyone has to suffer from this.

1926.12.2005 07:51

As long as the forum will not be monitored/policed this will just be an inconvience. A little more searching and P2P downloads.

2026.12.2005 09:06

Hey All, sad news. I have a suggestion though. While I like that you provided a link to all the content to be removed--making it easier for us to back it up now--I think it would be awesome to provide a zip file or some sort of compilation of all the guides and software (maybe just guides as the software might start to get a lil big). Anyway, just a thought I had, seeing as there are over 10 guides that would be a pain in the @$$ to save one at a time. If anyone gets around to doing this, plz post the URL. Otherwise, someone IM me @ Persbian on AIM and after getting a compilation together when I am home from work, I will send you a zip file that you can post for everyone. As for the ++Piracy stuff: Listen, I am all for copying dvds and stuff. but some of the ppl griping on here need to get one thing straight. These laws do 'good'. Sucks for us because we're used to getting stuff for free, but these laws are LIMITING piracy. If you extend the argument that these laws will never stop piracy and pirates dont care about the law, maybe we should do away with murder laws? I mean, some people that commit murder now do so fully aware of possible consequences but we insist on murder laws to REDUCE the number of murders as best we can--just as this and other piracy laws are aiming to do. Listen, Im not advocating anti-piracy or piracy, I am just trying to get you to start thinking about better arguments to support your position. Instead of griping 'corporation this' 'greedy people that', think about what piracy does. Isn't that a form of greed? You're not paying for the software or anything else that people worked to put out. That being said, i think certain things are egregiously over-priced (i.e. music CDs, M$ windows, etc), but argue about how the prices should be controlled rather than how unfair it is. Maybe the way to fight back is to lobby for 'price ceilings' and for the RIAA to loosen its grip on the musical industry and allow for independent artists to emerge. They could even find a way to reduce the RIAA cut (musicians make little per CD, they make their money in concerts). Anyway, those are just a few ideas to consider. Please, if you want to have a civil discussion about what I said, fine, but dont flame.

2126.12.2005 09:06

@Mik3h: Discussing about things is still allowed, its just "organized" stuff, like guides from aD Ltd tht will be removed. You can discuss about whatever you want in our forums, just like now. Filepedia will be affected by this as well, same software removals will be applied there.

2226.12.2005 09:19

The corporations don't seem to understand when there is an action, there is a reaction. Sony is finding that out which has become VERY costly to them and they still haven't won. Sorry that Finland has decided to follow most everyone else in their efforts to stop copying DVD/CD etc. One nice deal though, Slysoft who makes AnyDVD located in Antiqua, West Indies can't be touched. It is beginning to look like they are the last bastian of hold-outs. Sorry for the rant.

2326.12.2005 10:00

@dRD Yeah, I realised that a while ago. Cheers, never quite understood it at first :P -Mike

2426.12.2005 12:01

distributing copy protection bypassing software and instructions for copy protecting bypassing illegal? censorship in the name of protecting copyrights. beyond outrageous! fuck the finnish law. feel free to sue me for distributing decss sources (that's both software and instructions).

2526.12.2005 12:18

I remember a while back reading a post by this website on how they did not give give a hoot and a holler and " did not give a damn "about people in the united states hollywood and the dmca. I hate playing playing the devils's advocate in saying it only would have been a matter of time the country of finland would have moved closer to the united states and great britain in thought and position about piracy ang copyright issues and resulting draconian changes in the finnish copyright law. If one isn't careful arrogance and ignorance can be bliss and one could easily get fooled. There was a lot of misquided young people who thought that unlimited fair use rights would never end in finland and finland will have to join in the united states' miserable concepts about copyright and patent law where it is ILLEGAL to copy a prerecorded dvd. The only thing i could say is you can never say that people did not try to say " i told you so ......"

2626.12.2005 12:25

Why can't afterdawn just host the website on a server located in a different country? I can't imagine that their residence would have any relevance to the copyright law. As long as the files are hosted in a different country it shouldn't matter where you live. I'm sure they currently have their own server, but for $10 a month you can get gigabytes of storage space and unlimited bandwidth. ( Just find a good hosting company in a country that isn't impacted by the new law.

2726.12.2005 12:46

host it on a north american server?

2826.12.2005 12:46

host it on a north american server?

2926.12.2005 13:05 was simply an example.

3026.12.2005 13:12

Host it in China, they copy everything

3126.12.2005 13:31

Hey all, I hope that the MODS don't get mad for this post, but... although they will have to make changes to this site, you may beable to look back at the forums from the Internet Archive site. I'm just not sure often they update the site/archive though. Just take a look back at the site from 2000, Afterdawn looks like it's come a long way.

This message has been edited since its posting. Latest edit was made on 26 Dec 2005 @ 1:34

3226.12.2005 13:49

Thank you Afterdawn for years of great service. It is a sad day to see your right so sharply curtailled. We can only hope that your countrymen see this as a violation of their rights and put up enough of a stink to reverse this decision. Thank you again, I am a very big fan.

3326.12.2005 13:50

Thank you Afterdawn for years of great service. It is a sad day to see your rights so sharply curtailled. We can only hope that your countrymen see this as a violation of their rights and put up enough of a stink to reverse this decision. Thank you again, I am a very big fan.

3426.12.2005 13:52

Thank you Afterdawn for years of great service. It is a sad day to see your rights so sharply curtailled. We can only hope that your countrymen see this as a violation of their rights and put up enough of a stink to reverse this decision. Thank you again, I am a very big fan.

3526.12.2005 13:58

Thank you Afterdawn for steering me to the right path. I only been on this website for almost two months and I learned alot.

3626.12.2005 14:30

This really sucks but as other people have said it doesnt change afterdawn it will still be the same place and same people. I hope everyone had a great christmas, and will have a great new year :) Well im gonna go start putting movies on the net, its christmas so im in the mood of giving :) j/k

3726.12.2005 14:33

I vow not to buy any new music or movies until this stupid law is amended. That might be a long time.

3826.12.2005 15:23

Ok I've compiled all the software into and all the guides into is a combination of both of them. I wasn't able to download DVD Extracter (I live in the states, tried getting around it, but no luck). Anyway, once RedFire (another user here) is back to his computer, I will send him the files and he will post them. BTW (parazitez), I will explain this from a US standpoint, as that is where I reside and am (somewhat) familiar with the law. The first amendment does protect free speech, but speech is not unrestricted. A common example is that you cannot say 'bomb' on an airplane. Also, you cannot threaten someone, and there are laws against slander. Essentially, the first ammendment protects your rights to free speech if it does not infringe on the rights of others. I think this is kind of a grey area, as you're giving instructions as how to do an illegal act, but I think its walking a very fine line and arguments for its illegality are valid (as could be some claims for its legality).

3926.12.2005 15:27

By the way, this is on a definite side tangent so mods feel free to remove this if you see fit. If anyone knows about RSS Feeds and how you can use them in conjunction with Azureus to auto-download TV shows-let me know. I've been trying to get it to work for some time now (I dont know if the whole thing got shut down or what). Thanks

4026.12.2005 15:34

"I can't imagine that their residence would have any relevance to the copyright law. " huh? of course it does.

4126.12.2005 15:45

That's excellent Persbian compiling all the softwares to zip files. I will surely have a copy of that once posted... Good thing I have backed up most of the Guides long ago....

4226.12.2005 16:29

OK Files have been sent to RedFire, he said he will post them soon!

4326.12.2005 17:25

transfer to redfire didn't work, if anyone else can post the files, my screenname on AIM is Persbian, send me an instant message.

4426.12.2005 18:10


These laws do 'good'. Sucks for us because we're used to getting stuff for free, but these laws are LIMITING piracy.
Sure and prohibition of alcohol limited drunkenness. Good effects are no excuse for laws that are too broad.
If you extend the argument that these laws will never stop piracy and pirates dont care about the law, maybe we should do away with murder laws?
Murder laws are fine because they prohibit only what is wrong. But a ban on kitchen knives with points (recently proposed in UK, no kidding) is not justified by the anti-murder values, because it addresses something that may just as well be innocent.
Im not advocating anti-piracy or piracy, I am just trying to get you to start thinking about better arguments to support your position. Instead of griping 'corporation this' 'greedy people that', think about what piracy does... You're not paying for the software or anything else that people worked to put out.
Right, well said. And it would apply here if these tools were only for piracy. But they are also for legit backups, format conversion, and other innocent activity. Not to mention the grossly unjust interference with freedom of speech - it should always be legal to give truthful information. Also, copyright law is excessive and some things that are piracy in the legal sense are not unethical in the moral sense. For example making available the original Star Wars which Lucas refuses to release; or works still being under copyright long after the creators are dead.

4526.12.2005 18:28

@JamPony Well put. I agree, these tools shouldn't be removed. I think that getting around copy-protection should not be what they take to task, instead it should be the distribution schemes (i.e. emule/bittorrent). A rant about your first point, I cannot make a case for the alcohol allowance, except that in moderation alcohol has been proven effective against heart disease and other health issues. I know that is not why the laws are around. I think that, like smoking, is the result of good corporate lobbies. In my opinion, smoking should be illegal-at least in public (recent evidence supports claims that exposure to second hand smoke can dramatically increase health risks). I think there is a lack of consistency with our government when it comes to substances like alcohol/drugs. Marijuana is illegal, yet alcohol and ciggarettes are not. But to bring it back to piracy, I meant to say that the community here too often tries to justify their actions by painting the industries as evil conglomerates. The arguments set forth by the pro-file sharing community that I am trying to take to task are covered in an interview with a starforce encryption member (i HATE STARFORCE lol), here is the URL: here is an exerpt to explain my point. <i>I wouldn't buy it anyway" - doesn't matter, fact is you didn't pay for it but benefited from the labor of the publisher and developer - that's theft. "Games are crap so often I don't want to get ripped off" - try reading reviews and playing demos. Besides, good luck getting a car dealership to refund you your money after you so much as signed the contract, never mind drove the car. Not all that many goods can be used and returned for your money back. "It doesn't hurt anyone, I'm not actually stealing". Technically, no, you're not picking up an item and walking away with it. But if you're not stealing, why are publishers and developers willing to spend money on copy protection that they know increases the hassle? They're not stupid, they know they're losing money to pirates. </i> The article goes on to point out ethical issues with copy protection, but like i said it is a sticky issue. I am just sick and tired of the internet lawyers (and I just know someones gonna call me hypocritical because i said that).

4626.12.2005 18:28

P.S. Files sent, should be posted soon

4726.12.2005 18:46

Here is a suggestion for the Afterdawn administrators. Please consider following these guidelines: * Instead of removing a guide or software page with no trace, leave the title (the former link text) and place a message saying "providing this factual information to the public has been prohibited by [name and number of law]" * Instead of removing sections of a guide invisibly, replace them with a notice saying "Finnish law [number], the '[name of law]' law, has required us to conceal this section from the public. Censored section contains [number of] words" This would keep people aware of the laws and what they are doing.

4826.12.2005 18:55

Here is an idea that just came to me. (and might just work) I remember reading not to long ago about the battle that kazaa went through with I believe it was Austria. The Austrian court told them to comply with a set of rules, and they didn't want to, they blocked all IP from that country. QUESTION? Would that work for afterdawn? You still offer everything you have on the site now, but ONLY block certain files and guides,(the ones you have listed here), from everyone that has an IP from YOUR country. Case in Point: You would NOT be breaking the law where you live, because the <unlawful> files and guides would NOT be available to the people of YOUR country. But would be to everyone else where the law does not apply.

4926.12.2005 19:07

they already do that with some files Ugc, DVD extracter is not available in the US, believe me-i tried downloading it. Its the one file i couldnt get for the .zip set that DF (if he responds) will post.

5026.12.2005 19:10

It's hard to say that "the Ministry of Education and main parties have been fully brainwashed by large media corporations who are the only ones gaining something from this law." It is their right not to get robbed. And as they are the ones gaining form the law, they are also the ones losing from piracy. My take: In all honesty, it's unfortunate but legitament.

5126.12.2005 19:21

Anyone know the best site for keeping current on the software that's going to be removed?

5226.12.2005 19:33

Persbian> But would it work? I believe that it would stand up in court. It makes legal since. No one in Finland could take afterdawn to court,(where the law applies) because they couldn't get it off this site. [removal of files] = [no access from Finland] same. same. Finland's law's don't apply to the rest of the world. And that being the case, would make it legal to use this IP blocking theory.

5326.12.2005 20:06

Persbian> I just downloaded dvd extractor and I live in the US (just answer no). But the way they have that set up is not what I am talking about. I'm saying a complete ban on all <illegal> software and guides from anyone with an IP address from Finland. Anyway, Have a Happy New Year Everyone!

5426.12.2005 20:08

When will the zip file be posted?

5526.12.2005 20:55

Made a rar of the whole set. Not sure where to post it tho. Will someone host it or torrent it if I pm it to them?

5626.12.2005 21:57

is this law only going to affect finland?

5726.12.2005 22:06

um...thats wierd ugc, it didnt work for me even when i pressed no. I suppose that could work, *shrug* im no lawyer-but i would think they talked it over with their lawyers and found that they had no options like that available. Also, i think they could still be prosecuted because they are located in Finland, I think its that the DISTRIBUTION is illegal in finland, so no matter what-its being distributed from their computers essentially. The only feasible option I see is to take on a partner in france or somewhere that allows file-sharing (i think i read france is ++P2P) anyway, I think if they grab a partner in a place where it is in fact legal for that activity and 'move' the company, it would be alright. I just think that if they did that they may have to change whom they host through and a bunch of other stuff and that could be a huge hassle.

5826.12.2005 22:07

On another note, I finished sending the file to Redfire635 on AIM a long time ago, he was supposed to post it, i dont know when he's going to get around to it, but I was hoping it would have been soon. Somebody want to give me another way to post it? I dont have any website of my own. I'll check this again in the morning. And, if anyone else is interested in it, you can IM me @ Persbian on AIM. I'd appreciate it if you posted a link to it here for everyone to enjoy though.

5926.12.2005 22:22

OK I made a GMAIL account. It has the guides now. If someone wants to post software bundle, feel free-but u have to break it up in chunks probably because it is too big for a single attachment (getting the guides there took long enough). The info for the login is below: URL: Username: afterdonn PWD: persbian enjoy!

6026.12.2005 22:26

We still need some web hosting. Say, for the freeware at least, and the guides. If anyone has ability to host, and can tolerate some traffic and won't be subject to legal hassles, pls contact me or Persbian thru this forum.

6126.12.2005 22:28

SOrry to post spam-last one tonite... If someone wants to post the software on the GMail, you will need to split it into 6-10 MB pieces and post them separately. GMail limits attachment size to that, so you cant get all 80 MB on the same attachment. I'm gona look into making a torrent for this. I've never done that before, but maybe it'll work. Let me know if you have any advice

6226.12.2005 22:33

Lol, you realise that the email address you posted will be removed by a mod. And that now you have a very high chance of it being flooded with spam.. -Mike

6326.12.2005 22:37

This sucks, but o well its your law and i really can't do anything about it btw. AFTERDAWN STILL ROCKS :)

6426.12.2005 22:50

Most or all of this software has been available elsewhere and will continue to be available tho less conspicuously now. I think the net effect of this new law will be that the ripping becomes more confined to more knowledgable people and it will be just a little harder to get sw tools. SOme of us will try to help others Anyone who makes a/v software, please make it open source, GPL especially, then it will be harder to suppress. Also, any reader who cares about freedom to do what you want with your digital files, write to your legislators when things like this are proposed, polite and well reasoned letters.

6526.12.2005 22:51

Wow, ok for reals this time. I have put the torrent file on the gmail account, i dont care if it gets spam-its not my account, and if you guys want to screw me over for helping you out, then thats sad. I know with gmail you can trace my actual e-mail address, please dont spam me. That being said, even if they remove the GMail, goto search for afterdawn. I am seeding the torrent as we speak. If all goes to plan, it shoudl be available any minute now. G'nite.

6626.12.2005 23:12

There is also another torrent now on the biggest tracker. Some of you know where to look, please tell others. On edit: Before i wasn't sure whether it was ok to post links. Here it is.

This message has been edited since its posting. Latest edit was made on 27 Dec 2005 @ 1:47

6726.12.2005 23:22

Persbian, thanks for compiling and uploading the stuff!

6827.12.2005 00:28

I couldn't think of anymore appropriate way to share the guides than BitTorrent. This pack just has the guides. EDIT: Okay my tracker was being difficult so here's an ED2K link: ed2k://|file|guides.7z|5373215|E63B5333F0E522BDAE480A6C029C61EA|h=VCUO7WUBSZDX4IENZGXEPJBEGEP7DIBL|/

This message has been edited since its posting. Latest edit was made on 27 Dec 2005 @ 12:41

6927.12.2005 00:34

I have the software torrent file on my site home page which can be found here :

This message has been edited since its posting. Latest edit was made on 27 Dec 2005 @ 12:35

7027.12.2005 02:27

And so it begins.

7127.12.2005 02:52

Conspiracy Theories Part IV Someone who has the power of the Administration must make deeper investigation about all theese things. I believe that in many cases the "hackers" acting on behalf of the major firms in the field aiming to make more money "under the table" which will be a black box for the tax services of their countries. No mater the income falls but the extras are equal with the loss. So they aproach the legitime authorities flying the flags agains piracy which is growing now under a controlled enviroment for their own benefit. Lets hope that also AfterDawn will move one way or the other to the same paradises where the majority of the haunters are sitted.

7227.12.2005 04:05

Hello fellows! I just joined. Afterdawn rocks. This is really bad news. Finnish people must not re-elect those SOBs. However, they cannot defeat the internet, the amount of resources required to excersise full control of content would be astronomical, they just can't afford it; They can however make it a little (emphasis on little) harder to find the good stuff, that's about it, we will always find it anyway; I just treat it as a challenge. I also try to be ahead of the game, that's why I have been making monthly Slysoft packs for about a year now, just in case you know!!! :wink:

So the maples formed a union
And demanded equal rights.
"The oaks are just too greedy;
We will make them give us light."

7327.12.2005 04:14

Seems rather long list, but then again, two alternatives left are either to close the site or face upto 1 year in prison.
Do the time! Fight the power! Just Kidding ;)

7427.12.2005 04:22

Bloody Governements. So much for free speech, freedom of expression etc, etc. Are the media companies part of a facist conspiracy???? ANyway, rant over, am downloading the torrent as we speak, will seed and upload to other trackers when i get it. Nice one Persabian.

7527.12.2005 04:36

Seems rather long list, but then again, two alternatives left are either to close the site or face upto 1 year in prison.
Damn government ultimatums, who cares though? its all gonna end up on P2P, torrents, gmails, anywhere. So they lose!

7627.12.2005 04:36

this is posted at cdfreaks.ask them to host the guides.. Via email today from one Charles Trino, we learn of some horrific news. It seems that the Finnish website AfterDawn, is being dealt a serious blow due to new copyright legislation passed last fall. They are taking steps now to avoid possible litigation that could become possible after the legislation takes effect January 1, 2006. Here is a quote from that news report from the Afterdawn website. a quote, Reaction Posted by Ranmacanada on 27 December 2005 You gotta love it, it is illegal to make a personal copy, but they still get the damn money to compensate for a possible personsal copy. The levy should be removed otherwise, it is no longer a levy, it is now a tax. Talk about double dipping!@

This message has been edited since its posting. Latest edit was made on 27 Dec 2005 @ 4:44

7727.12.2005 06:36

Good! Looks like the software got out there. My torrent didn't end up working i suppose-*shrug* was my first attempt. But, I am happy everyone got what they wanted in the end. ENJOY!

7827.12.2005 08:48

I apologise for the delay of links to get the guides and software. I've uploaded the guides already and I have started uploading the software. Make sure to thank Persbian for all his hard work! Guides (3 different sources): Software:

This message has been edited since its posting. Latest edit was made on 27 Dec 2005 @ 10:48

7927.12.2005 09:00

I think it's time to get things, in perspective. AfterDawn is a great site...And hopefully will remain so! nudge nudge wink wink. The powers that be; aren't interested in us, we're the tip of the iceberg... example 1 Two years ago MS were going to launch Longhorn Before it was on the market...It was being sold in Hong kong for less than a ..sterling. example 2 unverified I live in a large UK city and most the major construction sites, are cruisedby attractive Asian girls selling DVDs'? In bulk.. I wouldn't panic....Prohibition didn't get that far. regards gringle

8027.12.2005 10:07

Forums * No changes That's all I wanted to hear.

8127.12.2005 11:32

i'm a new user (bougth a swap magic disc a couple of months ago ;-p), this site has taught me everything i know, stuff like this is pissy and annoying there's always people like me who buy the games, it's not like companies such as EA give more than 10$ an hour to the developers or anyone who makes the game happen, this site is excellent the people here have helped me back up battlefront 2 (ps2) which everybody knows was a brutal task! thanks for all the help, the people here kick tits, not like certain captitalist pricks... much love afterdawn

8227.12.2005 11:37

Can someone upload the files in HTML format with the graphics included?

8327.12.2005 12:31

Thank you both for the files.

8427.12.2005 19:20

This sucks!!!! I love this site. Hey would u still be able to put whatever u what in the forms? Like how to back u games and shit?

8527.12.2005 23:25

Quick question isn't there a way to save the guides to PDF format? I seem to remember a program that could convert web pages to PDF including all the graphics but I'm not sure. It's either that or just click "save as" and save the html files to be viewed offline I guess.

8628.12.2005 01:15

If anyone needs help you could always just jump onto the Afterdawn IRC chatroom.

8728.12.2005 01:39

Sorry. triple post

This message has been edited since its posting. Latest edit was made on 28 Dec 2005 @ 11:58

8828.12.2005 01:43

Sorry. Triple post.

This message has been edited since its posting. Latest edit was made on 28 Dec 2005 @ 11:59

8928.12.2005 03:19

Just some thoughts of ancient Greek philosophers. They said: "Law is like spider's web. It can catch the small insects. The big ones can break it and pass through." Dedicated to lawlovers. Nevermind. As we have the will to live, we continue charging. ;-) Happy New Year!!! :-)

9028.12.2005 04:19

If anyone needs help you could always just jump onto the Afterdawn IRC chatroom.
I second that. Anyone needing help or "stuff" should come to the unofficial aD IRC channel. Any of you who wish to drop by, there is a simple step by step with pictures on how to do so here --> Or anyone who already has an IRC client hurry up and join! Server: Channel: #ad_buddies Any of you who do not/cannot install an IRC client for whatever reason can use the java-based chat - Do NOT use your AfterDawn forum password when the java IRC client asks you to provide a nickname and password. That is only for people who have registered their nickname on the stormchat irc network, not on AfterDawn. -Mike
This message has been edited since its posting. Latest edit was made on 28 Dec 2005 @ 4:25 - Guides written by me. - Join us Live on IRC!

(Kudos to Ripper For The Beautiful Sig!)

9128.12.2005 09:38

Seems rather long list, but then again, two alternatives left are either to close the site or face upto 1 year in prison.
Sorry mate, there's only 1 alternative: Do the time! Don't worry, a lot of us will visit you and take fags, phone cards etc... It's not a good thing having to restrict so much this site, a lot of us will get banned for forgetting about the new laws...

9228.12.2005 10:12

Do the time? They would seize the servers etc. They would sue Afterdawn you know.. -Mike

9328.12.2005 10:15

C'mon man! Don't take it serious! Be a sport! I know it would be a little bit more complicated than to just do the time!

9428.12.2005 10:18

Hmmm.. -Mike - Guides written by me. - Join us Live on IRC!

(Kudos to Ripper For The Beautiful Sig!)

9528.12.2005 10:41

Hey Mike, c'mon... You and everyone knew that sooner or later they would come down on AD... This is the place to learn EVERYTHING there is about backups and stuff... The thing is there's not a lot they can do to us users, because it's not a crime to KNOW how to do it! As long as you don't do it... So we can keep this place going... easily! What do you think?

This message has been edited since its posting. Latest edit was made on 28 Dec 2005 @ 10:42

9628.12.2005 11:09

This really fucking sucks... I think the guides are the most important... We can always download the software from somewhere else...

9728.12.2005 11:22

@Reddy634 Thank you for the links to the guides.Nice to see them in Word format too.

9828.12.2005 11:30

@Liberal- have some manners, we all are a bit miffed with the situation, but there's no need for that language... (Don't let the Mods see it - edit your post.) The guides are important but i'm sure we'll be able to get access to them through other channels... For now just make sure you get the ones you need...

9928.12.2005 12:04

Perhaps if you talk to the guys on the chatroom you might be able to get guideing hand. /me smirks :-

This message has been edited since its posting. Latest edit was made on 28 Dec 2005 @ 12:05

10028.12.2005 12:09


10128.12.2005 12:28

Here are all the guides (as it appeared on the pages with graphics) in pdf form... Can someone put these guides on a torrent site? It would be much better served that way.

10228.12.2005 12:33

couldn't the site be transformed into a more "educational" reference... i believe that's protected under the law

10328.12.2005 15:19

I don't think in arena of the law that trying to having something listed as an edcuational could still be out there if it show you something that is against the law. For example there was a police officer here in the USA got into to trouble for showing students at a high school. How Crystal Meth is made and why it is bad for you. His point for the class was show the students the dangerous chemcials used in making it. What he got heat for is that it showed someone how to make it, from start to finish product. Which is making a controled substance that is against the law and the cop was a drug detective. So if Afterdawn kept anything here could show a person how to get around the copyright protection, it could be considered against the law. And with all the pinheads out there that are just looking to make easy money, they can take them to court. I say to my Finnish friends maybe a trip across the water a bit say to Russia, I am sure they wouldn't mind some money. To have something like this website based in their country. Just a thought

10428.12.2005 15:35

Dunno Pirate... Here in UK you can buy books specialized on guns... Yet you simply cannot have one. Knoledge isn't a crime. I know how to grow weed... Does that make me a criminal? Or a dealer? No! Now, if i DID grow it, then it would be a crime. It's the old story of the knife. A knife in the hands of a professional chef, isn't dangerous, it is a tool. In the hands of a criminal, it's a weapon. It's all to do with points of view... I use these guides to backup my own stuff, only because it was hard to buy the original, i don't want to have to buy another one if a damage this one... I'm safekeeping my property. But i need to know how to do it... Is that a crime?

If it ain't broken it doesn't need fixing...
Newbies, look for it here first:
The Holy List:

10528.12.2005 16:02

Thanks for the memories AD.COM!!! Man it really sucks when a great site is taken down or forced to "change" its philosophy. It's never the same after that. I just finished downloading the guides. For those of you who are asking for PDA or Word versions with graphics, there is really no need for them. To keep the graphics all you need to do is save the page as as single archive using Internet Explorer. I've done that with some helpful threads too. Sympathies from Puerto Rico

10628.12.2005 16:43

How many of these software programs will die as a result of this new law (ie DVD Decrypter died because the author lived in the UK and they passed similar laws)(Thanks by the way for keeping a copy on Afterdawn.) By the way, why aren't Decrypter and Shrink on the list of software to be removed - they are the Dynamic Duo for dubbing. I realize your site can't advise folks how to rip/decrypt anymore, but what about someone posting a question in the forums about having problems backing up "Ishtar" and someone else posts a reply telling how to do it? Afterdawn didn't post the methods, another individual did. Would Afterdawn take the blame for one user posting the info to another? Maybe a FAQ (frequently asked questions) board is in order?

10728.12.2005 19:17

i have all the ammo i need, THANKS AFTERDAWN STAFF!!!!!

10828.12.2005 19:28

I have a question for drD, or Dela or Ketola. Is Filepedia owned by aD? And if so, how will the new Finnish law affect it? (Got a good idea... **grimmacing**) Just curious.

All men profess honesty as long as they can. To believe all men honest would be folly. To believe none so is something worse. -John Quincy Adams

10928.12.2005 19:31

@Jerkism I tried to create a torrent using the zip file you made. I am not 100% sure it works though. To check it out go to and type in Afterdawn. Then find the one thats called AfterDawn Guides. Someone let me know if it works. If it doesn't, could someone refresh me on how to make and upload a torrent with BitComet? Thanks

11028.12.2005 19:37

Que Mal... Well I still like Afterdawn and always will be my place for help and help other cheers and keep the good work,we can still do it without those things, people make the places not the buildings! Another Greeting from Puerto Rico!

11128.12.2005 20:27

@AhrenBa - the torrent seems fine, but you have to SEED it... FYI, I've moved it to "Misc > E-Books"

11228.12.2005 21:38

@JXP2307: Yes, Filepedia is owned by AfterDawn Ltd and same changes apply there, unfortunately. AfterDawn will continue to host appx. 500 a/v tools even after the change of law, which means that we still have one of the most complete software selection for video enthusiasts on Earth, but the rippers will be gone. Some people have questioned reasoning behind certain CDDA rippers like Easy CDDA Extractor and WinDAC -- the reaosning is with them that a) In Finland, it seems that record labels are the "trigger happy court companies" rather than movie studios b) Audio tools only produce about 1 percent of our site's daily downloads Thus, the reaosning with certain CD rippers was to be rather "safe than sorry". Additionally, we will try to make a complete download package today to be distributed via BitTorrent and/or ed2k network that will contain all the tools, guides-to-be-removed and a short readme instructing on how to distribute the package further, hoping that it will help people who are trying to save all the content that is about to get neutered. Those of you asking "well, can I link to X" or "can we talk about how to do this" on forums in future, the answer is yes, yes you can. We wont censor our forums, you can talk about anything on forums, providing that you follow our forum rules, as always.

11328.12.2005 22:11

What about some of the guides inside the forums that deals with DVD Decrypter (ie DVD-R/+R for Newbies, DVD-R/+R for Advanced users and PS2 DVD backups forum, etc.), are those to be removed too?

WARNING: Do not "update/upgrade" your SAMSUNG BD-D5XXX series (Bluray Player), or else you cant enjoy any of your movie files.
How 2 downgrade Samsung BD-D5XXX Series Bluray player

11428.12.2005 22:20

dRD: Thanks for the answer about filepedia. I love that site :>( Anyway, aD will still have my patronage, and to me it changes nothing. Glad to see that the forums will remain untouched. I have learned a greeat deal in the past year. We, the aD faithful will continue to "Pay it forward" so to speak. God Bless.

11529.12.2005 05:39

@MaggiePix Sorry, but I am new to BitTorrent. Could you help me out and tell me how and what seeding is? Thanks

11629.12.2005 07:21

seeding is the process of making a file available for transfer between yourself and another person. If you have a file that is already finished downloading then instead of continuing to download you start to just upload to other users. now, seeing as how you already have the guides as pdf documents all you have to do is using you existing torrent client right click on the torrent and tell it to start.

11729.12.2005 16:45

I hate to see this happen to this company its been a great help to me and my friends in so many years.What will be the outcome of this site now with this happening what support or help will this leave you guys/gals to do now,what are you people gonna do now with so much time on your hands.

11829.12.2005 17:41

AD will be the same as always. I think we're gonna be 'free' to discuss whatever we discuss... The changes are for the guides mainly. As far as i know, the forum side of AD will stay the same. I could be wrong tough...

If it ain't broken it doesn't need fixing...
Newbies, look for it here first:
The Holy List:

11929.12.2005 17:47

it's pretty much, business as usual when it comes to the forum side of the site.

This message has been edited since its posting. Latest edit was made on 29 Dec 2005 @ 5:51

12029.12.2005 19:28

Why can't some of us start a thread in the forums with the guides from AD and have a mod sticky them? From my understanding the forum will stay intact. Strat

Important info
How to burn gapless audio CDs from mp3s (Courtesy djscoop)

12129.12.2005 20:37

Roll with the punches, I guess. Loved this site for years and will still faithfully visit. Great guides, great software, great forums, great site!

12229.12.2005 22:02

Well, for most of those guides going, I've only used at the most 2, then just improvised or looked for better solutions otherwise. It's still gonna be the same site, just with its main batch of programs missing. Forums will undoubtedly stay the same, but no one shouldn't doubt the undoubtable. Anyway, hope you guys at AD stay strong, and keep up the good work. How come you guys changed your scheme from gray and black to what it is now? Late!

If Im online, Im usually on Steam:

12330.12.2005 02:15

I thought someone had a gmail account with these guides? Also is anyone hosting the content on here I read about a torrent file?

12430.12.2005 02:40

forget about the torrent, for that we actually need to have seeders all the time and I doubt that will happen. just come into the chatroom and you can get the guides there. You can get into the java chat here

12530.12.2005 05:45

Hi all, i know its a bit late (sorry me heads been in the sand), but can the guides not be converted into pdf rar'd and then posted for immediate download together. Also how about having your site hosted from a country that doesn't have to support this new legislation, just a thought. Keep, up the good work. Keep it safe. :)

12630.12.2005 07:15

i have all the software and guide being banned and edited in a .zip file where can i upload them?

12730.12.2005 08:24

if its only finland which is affected, why cant afterdawm simply change there country and still remain top dog for guides, software etc... Wylie:)

This message has been edited since its posting. Latest edit was made on 05 May 2006 @ 10:22

12830.12.2005 09:26

svar91- i have all the software and guide being banned and edited in a .zip file where can i upload them?
its right here but it 80 megs :(
This message has been edited since its posting. Latest edit was made on 30 Dec 2005 @ 4:12

12930.12.2005 09:28

Who's gonna seed it permanently? You? If you can get a lot of people to do it, then go for it... Otherwise, forget about it...

If it ain't broken it doesn't need fixing...
Newbies, look for it here first:
The Holy List:

13030.12.2005 11:17

I posted all the guides the other day AS .PDF FORMAT. It's about 5mb for all the guides. Here are the links again... All the links lead to the same guides. If someone who knows how, just upload these guides as a torrent and post a link to the torrent here. You have to seed the torrent until others have a copy as well or else no one will be able to download it.

13130.12.2005 12:42

The torrents for the software do not work.

13230.12.2005 13:10

Hi all, I dont drop in that often to aD, last time i did i think Decrypter had just been killed.. another sad day.. well wounded to hear this news today.. can't we send the stuff thats supposed to be removed to Mr. SlySoft in Antigua & ask him to host it on his servers? That would be nice.. He seems to have it sussed for now :)

13330.12.2005 13:27

Hi all, I'm a newbie on the forum, but have been tracking with AD ever since DVD X Copy was pulled off the shelves and technical support for it was shut down. You guys intro'd me to Shrink and Decrypter and my life has been "fair use" better ever since so thank you all very much. Up to now I had been relying on the "one click" solutions of DVD X Copy and Shrink and Decrypter, but I realize I will one day have to master VOB Blanker, the deassemble/reassemble abilities of Decrypter etc etc. As I get up to speed on my understanding of basic DVD structure and CSS-- I've purchased DVD FAB Platinum from I learned about here at AD)and have had great success. I make a full back up of each new disc I buy, and then I make a "main movie" copy for qualitative reasons. The DVDfab team is in CHina. Even their government will cave, and kill the "BETAMAX fair use" mentality---but for now, China seems to be the "defender of Liberty" at the moment in terms of fair use, with the DVDidle team. I also wish to make a financial contribution to After Dawn, because I not only want to support what they'll be doing for us in the future, but financially thank them for all the help AD has given to me already. AfterDawn addict for as long as possible.

This message has been edited since its posting. Latest edit was made on 30 Dec 2005 @ 1:57

Michael Cowles
Springfield Virginia USA

13430.12.2005 13:31

Do us a favor MikecUSA: Edit that post and brake it into different lines please. It's hard to read it like that... Cheers mate ;)

If it ain't broken it doesn't need fixing...
Newbies, look for it here first:
The Holy List:

13530.12.2005 14:10

Mikec USA: China the "dDefender of Liberty"??? Are you serious? They're thieves who operate with a wink and a nod from their dictatorship goverment. They steal intellectual and other properties FOR PROFIT, period! They are not Robin Hoods, they're just plain hoods. They are not backing-up a dvd or 2 for themselves, they are selling poor quality crap copies by the millions, strictly for the money. Man, find a different cause!

13630.12.2005 14:32

I've taken advantage of the CC licensed articles and have posted the two english articles here: I've also availed myself to the zip file posted here and will, soon into the new year, post the files as well, if there is demand. What are they going to do to a drunken Canuck, sue him?

13730.12.2005 14:47

yes and if anybody wants individual softwares you can PM me what software you want and ill send you the link. and you can get the .zip file here:

This message has been edited since its posting. Latest edit was made on 30 Dec 2005 @ 4:50

13830.12.2005 15:49

I haven't frequented the boards very much since I joined, but Afterdawn has been a fantastic source of information and tools. I'll take this opportunity to say thank you, thank you _very_much_ for your efforts. Robert

13930.12.2005 15:52

This is much like satellite hacking sites when the television service providers decided to hit them, they still exist but they have a disclosure that you have to agree to before entering the site. This seems to get around specific laws by professing that the information presented is for 'experimental and teaching purposes only' and is not to be used for commercial gain. This ensures (in my opinion) that there is no commercial gain to be made by providing this software (irrespective on whether you pay the writers or not, for most instances you are not selling the software for this function and therefor not responsible for its use)), however if you were to provide an encripted access site that allows the information to members only this should also suffice. Now if you were to also provide links to hack sites that provide key generators to operate this software illegally, then you would obviously be responsible for the use and in this respect to prosecution. Regards and wish all a heppy new year

14030.12.2005 16:16

I am not going to give up hope. I think it is truely unfair that we are not allowed to "backup" DVD's. I do believe that justice will prevail and the "powers" (dimwits) that are in control will lose or come to their senses!!!!!

14130.12.2005 17:28

I knew this was coming sooner or later. Backups of tools you need are a valuable asset. I think anyone that has any sense has already done what is necessary. Sadly, "Big Brother" is stepping on toes & asserting their authority... again. The thing is, they have just made a huge mistake. Human nature dictates, the best way to get someone to do something is to tell them they can not do it. Duh. They just made things escalate!

Use The Best Media for The Best Burns! TYs, Verbs,(Made in Taiwan) Sony MIJs (YUDEN000 T02), Sony Made in Taiwan DVD+R 16x, Maxell MIJ, RITEK G05.

14230.12.2005 17:36

TIME TO FIGHT BACK QUOTE: Tired of being treated like a criminal? They depend on you, not the other way around. Don't buy their 'product'. Do bug your local political representatives. Use emails, snail-mail, phone calls, faxes, IM, stop them in the street, blog. And if you're into organizing, organize petitions, organize demonstrations and then turn up on your local political rep's doorstep, making sure you've contacted your local tv/radio station/newspaper in advance.

14330.12.2005 18:03

Even though you have to remove these guides and software are people aloud to post where we can find them else where?

14430.12.2005 18:14

I was being a little tongue in cheek about China and liberty. I know that the communist government is and has been guilty of a great many terrible things, but I'm glad it currently allows DVDFab to operate. That won't last forever there either, but its one of the few places when "fair use" copying is still legal. "Fair Use" has been abused in China, but along with that extreme situation, I can still enjoy my normal fair use rights a little longer. All things considered I would much rather remain living in the USA than live in China.

14530.12.2005 18:54

Like they say in the p0rn biz "Thanks for the mammaries!". I appreciate what you folks have done in the past as well as the feedback from the forum folk. Am I correct in assuming that the forum will still be a great place to find out about items such as AnyDVD? Wolf

14630.12.2005 18:54 <---Guides <---Software There ya go. & there will always be atleast 1 seeder, the some of the guys in the IRC room have agreed to seed for us :) The site is one that ya have to join though sorry :( You can join up here. Feel free to uplaod the .torrent file to any other site ya want :)

This message has been edited since its posting. Latest edit was made on 30 Dec 2005 @ 7:09

14730.12.2005 22:16

It seems that the money here is the issue rather than the consumer desires.The profit of the few has to be excessive to the demands of the many..,With millions of dollars currently being made and the ultimate cash cow of movie producers being milked to the max one has to wonder how much greed is ever going to be enough for the oppulent?!?!?! And now every wealthy controller is siding with the oppulent because they are that themselves.Control Freaks have to control or they begin to lose control!! How anal retentive has this arguement become? Shame on them for their laziness. Another solution they have not covered is the PVR recording off of satellite tv..,same as duplicating and can be recorded to the computer without virus'.Bet that they are as stupid as the day is long in summer solstice for sure because they missed this as legal too.ha ha ha ha ha ha

14830.12.2005 23:31

You can download the guides here until I run out of data transfer for the month DVD-R.html" class="korostus" target="_blank"> they are in two zip files.....

14930.12.2005 23:36

Well Iguess I messed up on the first one so here it is again........ You can download the guides here until I run out of data transfer for the month

15031.12.2005 00:30

i can't believe this, i'm from the UK and i would have thought these laws would be put on countries like mine,the states places where this kind of thing is more widespread, they use the smaller countries as examples to scare otheres into changing the way they run their sites. As for your site having to be torn apart and edited to please these ass's. i really enjoy getting your news letters,infact yours is the only one i read and will miss it alot. will you still be able to include the same content in your news letters, or does that come under the new law too. Once again, sorry about the bad news

15131.12.2005 00:52

only been visiting this site for about a year,found it by accident as a complete rookie to my friends seem to think im some kind of expert when it comes to dvds and cd copying e.t.c.the sadness of my heart is almost overwhelmed with the thought that perhaps if it was today that i found all you great wonderfull and generous people you may not be able to educate and satisfy my thirst for the knowledge that you have all taught myself over that past make one last statement,god bless you all and a very prosperous and happy new year.p.s yes im a bit drunk and emotional!!!!

15231.12.2005 01:13

Why is everyone panicking about AD's changes to the new laws? This site isn't going to shut down! The forum is going to stay the same, it's business as usual, (british favorite moto) instead of linking to them guides directly, we'll have to get them somewhere else, but newbies and others alike will still be able to get the info here! I agree with you Cascadeuk, this is the sort of b@ll@x you'd see Blair comig up with... This IS the place in Europe where you have the most amazingly crazy laws... (i.e congestion charge)

If it ain't broken it doesn't need fixing...
Newbies, look for it here first:
The Holy List:

15331.12.2005 01:26

The spirit of AfterDawn will never die! The Genie's out the bottle, and they can huff, and puff all they like. It ain't going back. a great, free, way of sharing stuff.... like large files. g

15431.12.2005 04:04

this may not be the right place to ask this question but here goes!! with the programs and guides that are going to be dorped is there a way i can download them directly on to cd or dvd disk

15531.12.2005 04:49

Well I suppose, you could download things from the internet into a file, and put the file on a disc? gringle

15631.12.2005 06:05

So with my brain in gear all these files are downloaded to my pc and will be burned to disk later today.......... Although one wonders am i breaking the law now having them on my HDD......or is that in offering them for download...or is that the loophole they`ll plug next? Even d/l the MAC ones and i dont own a mac....well not a powerpc one anyways....osx86 is something else tho. .....anyone who wants these tools will always get them....especially if they ask me! This message will self destruct in 28 the rumoured (80`s british video cassettes)...

15731.12.2005 06:59

I look around me and the starwars springs to mind... I wonder how long it will be before the Goverments that are supposed to be our Public Servants, turn in on thereselves to become something more like Dictatorships, where their agendas become more important, than the people that they supposedly represent! Thanks Afterdawn for all your help so far!

15831.12.2005 07:35

if you want software link PM me

15931.12.2005 07:50

just so everyone knows. we switched from having the torrent on a "registered user" site to a public site. All the software and the guides can now be downloaded from <---Software <---Guides Feel free to up the torrent file to any tracker you wish... Infact I advise everyone to share these files as much as possible :)

16031.12.2005 07:56

That's right. Now all you lazy folk have no excuse hehe : -Mike - Guides written by me. - Join us Live on IRC!

(Kudos to Ripper For The Beautiful Sig!)

16131.12.2005 08:36

and if you dont have bittorrent you can download a zip here:

This message has been edited since its posting. Latest edit was made on 01 Jan 2006 @ 2:19

16231.12.2005 09:27

If you need a host for the guides then pm me. I offer free hosting so they can be stored on there with a download link.its the least i can do after so much advice on here has helped me.

16331.12.2005 10:07

I've downloaded and made a torrent of all the above software, its only about 70 mb, here's the link:

16431.12.2005 10:18

Just a note to say thanks for all the guides and help and software over the years. I would not have the skills with video files that I now have, if not for this site. It's sad that others will not have the same advantage when searching for help. I will also do my best to make these files available to others. Kathleen

16531.12.2005 10:29

It's not just the burning... When you come across problems when trying to burn something, you always learn about something different like drivers, firmwares of all sort of things that you otherwise wouldn't even realize thy're there! So it's not only on burning that you learn a lot, it's about everything! And of course, the people here are brilliant, their pacience to help us is beyond belief!

If it ain't broken it doesn't need fixing...
Newbies, look for it here first:
The Holy List:

16631.12.2005 10:36

I do believe the movie industry has gone a little too far and has proven over and over how powerful they are around the world. I know one way to hit them where it really hurts and not break any laws what so ever! Just don't buy any new DVD movies on the market and do not go to see any movies for one month. United we stand devided we all fall. Money talks so what do you all think of this? I'm willing, what about you all?

16731.12.2005 10:59

Good idea to IMMEDIATELY download what you do not have. Consider giving a donation, so small even $5, to help attorneys fight this Draconian law in court. Help out the people who HELP you. That's AD.

16831.12.2005 11:05

Is there a support page, a system where we can securely donate money for the further operation of AD? We all have enough of the software and guides to share, but this community must continue, it's the heart of AD that we're all apart of, and without money AD will fade. I assume there is a way to donate, I just don't know of the way.

16931.12.2005 11:13

heres a lady Patti Santangelo that needs the money to fight the RIAA PATRICIA SANTANGELO, SUED BY RECORDING INDUSTRY: How the RIAA gets its victims p2p news / p2pnet: The bizarre sue 'em all marketing scheme perpetrated by Organized Music's RIAA (Recording Industry Association of America) has gone mainstream and OM's owners, Sony BMG, Vivendi Universal, Warner Music and EMI, are on the verge of a blistering PR disaster equally as serious as the one currently enjoyed by Sony. The Big Four are treating their customers like shit, not to put too fine a point on it. But as more and more corporate print and electronic media outlets pick up the Patti Santangelo story, the lid is coming off. Santangelo is the New York mother who's defying the labels as they try to blackmail her into admitting guilt for something she didn't do. And Sony BMG, et al, are now using Santangelo's children as a weapon meant to force her into abandoning her stance. Meanwhile, p2pnet is launching a donation campaign to help Santangelo in her battle against rthe mutli-billion-dollar against Organized Music industry and its henchmen. read it all here more on her story here By JIM FITZGERALD, Associated Press Writer Sun Dec 25,10:33 AM ET WHITE PLAINS, New York - It was Easter Sunday, and Patricia Santangelo was in church with her kids when she says the music recording industry peeked into her computer and decided to take her to court. The industry is demanding thousands of dollars to settle the case, but Santangelo, unlike the 3,700 defendants who have already settled, says she will stand on principle and fight the lawsuit.

This message has been edited since its posting. Latest edit was made on 31 Dec 2005 @ 11:21

17031.12.2005 11:51

When you buy a dvd or cd you should have the right to copy it for yourself after all once you bought it you own it right! All these big companys make out they are sooooo honest. I bet they don't pay all their tax in an honest way. What about all their doggy dealings when they con the public and mislead people into buying a product that isn't what it seems. European laws and big companys are all suiting themselfs so they can charge more and more. These companys are trying to run our lives just because they are BIG. All I can say is COMMUNISTS is what they are.

Asus P5WD2 Premium Motherboard
Lian Li PC60 PLus Case
Pentium 4 3Ghz Processor
NVIDIA GeForce 6600 GT PCI-E
Crucial 2Gbs DDR2 Ram
System Temps idle 32C for the Processor,30C motherboard
Hitachi 250GB Hard drive,Hitachi 160GB Hard drive
Western Digital 160GB Hard drive.

17131.12.2005 12:41

Unfortunately the big media/motion picture companies contribute huge sums of money to political organizations in all countries. Unless citizens band together and buy our politicians back, the same restrictive laws will only push us farther in the corner. It is sad, but the truth is that citizens are simply slaves of the big businesses that take our hard earned money. As far as I am concerned, these big companies need to be declared monopolies and broken up into less legislative steering businesses. Power to the PEOPLE!

17231.12.2005 13:26

REMEMBER IF SHE WINS ITS A WIN FOR YOU. Patti Santangelo campaign launch ! p2pnet special: The p2pnet Patti Santangelo Fight Goliath campaign is now officially underway, thanks to Jason Rohrer, who produced the script below. ow create a Patti Santangelo Fight Goliath donations button for your own website! Patti is the New York working mother with five children who's decided she's not caving in to Sony BMG, Vivendi Universal, Warner Music or EMI, the multi-billion-dollar members of the Organized Music cartel which has been trying to extort 'settlement' money from her, and more than 17,000 others like her, including school kids. She is NOT willing to be blackmailed for something she didn't do and when she presents her case to a jury on an as-yet to be determined date, she'll be the first to meet these hard-core, multi-billion-dollar bullies with their teams of PR hacks, their bought-and-paid for politicians, their unimaginably vast financial and legal resources, face-to-face. read the rest here

17431.12.2005 16:30

Thank you very much for the kind attention I have been given whenever I have had a problem backing up my media. I feel really badly that this site was interfered with by the powers that be. I won't have a problem boycotting the studios for the next year. After the Sony fiasco I didn't purchase any media of any kind for gifts or for myself. Good luck to all the wonderful people on this site. I will still visit and I hope you still send out your newsletter.

17531.12.2005 18:18

This site has helped me more than any site that I belong to. The main thing that it has helped me with is problems not only about backing up media but with my compuyter as well. Hope it still says healthy and available for people like me to find the answer to my problems in a lot of areas. Tom

17631.12.2005 19:13


17731.12.2005 19:19

:-( tis a sad day

17831.12.2005 20:04

gooooo i am so glad the fight shall not fall at least here--happy new year all and keep up the great work and effort---manyyyyyy thanks to all

17931.12.2005 20:16

DAMN! DAMN! DAMN! DAMN! DAMN! There always messing with us! Hey! Teachers, leave those kids alone! All in All it's just another brick in the wall!!!!!!!

18031.12.2005 21:10

Hurry...Hurry....Hurry Download them all before there gone. Copy the Guides Do whatever it takes to retain this information.

1811.1.2006 00:36

This is very sad but as others have done I want to express my appreciation of your site. I still think the MPA will hve a hard time putting the genie back in the bottle.

1821.1.2006 02:21

This action simply is an affirmative to the statement that all business men are theives because they insist upon overcharging clients for their products and make no distinction between fair profit and sheer greed. The UK is a prime example of company greed because its citizens have to pay much more for programmes, DVD's etc. than the rest of Europe. However, in this instance a quick scan of the internet revealed the fact that the programmes that afterdawn is compelled to remove are still avilable on many other sites and long may they flourish.

1831.1.2006 04:56

Afterdawn has been a wealth of information on many topics and has served me well as a source for many guides on how to's in the complex world for the audio and video challenged. I hope that in the future that people like me that have gained benefit from this site will continue to lend support to it and maybe in some way we can pool together our resources to continue to boycott the products sold by the Large Media Corporations including Sony. Having been a fan of Sony products in the past, I for one, will no longer purchase any products in the future that have the Sony logo or any of its affiliate company's (BMG) etc. When Sony sells their Vaio Computers with a CD and DVD burner in it exactly what do the Corporate Heads think they are going to be used for? Hopefully, the recent loss of posting software and guides won't deter our spirits as their availability will continue on elsewhere in posted torrent sites so if you havn't dowloaded them yet now would be a good time to do so.

1841.1.2006 05:49

Interesting question: The link in the announcement called "Bypassing DVD copy protections" actually links to a guide called "Copy DVD to DVD-R using DVD Decrypter (DVDs smaller than 4.36GB)" (The same guide as the one mentioned a couple of lines above). However, a Guide called "Bypassing DVD Copy Protections" does exist, (here: Does anyone know for sure whether the bypassing copy protections guide is actually to be removed, and have people been backing it up? GilesF EDIT: that's the sort of guide that you would expect them to have to remove, isn't it...

This message has been edited since its posting. Latest edit was made on 01 Jan 2006 @ 5:55

1851.1.2006 07:37

As so many others have said; I have learned much from Afterdawn. My general computer skills have been elevated and I can also be a resource for my friends. This is indeed a sad day. Frank, Chicago

1861.1.2006 12:55

So, after all these years of loving After Dawn, it comes down to the lawyers again. DVD X-Copy moved to Belize after being hunted to extinction by the US lawyers. So, where might we all live in peace where Netflix will deliver? Good luck AfterDawn. We hope you'll come out the other side and resurrect the best of the best. Thanks to all who have the info backed-up and available as torrents or simple downloads. The P2P makes one nervous, given the 'peeking' by authorities. I guess it's time to go off the grid for good - anyone else? Happy New Year and Cheers....AA

1871.1.2006 13:35

thanks for svar91 for posting the link!

This message has been edited since its posting. Latest edit was made on 01 Jan 2006 @ 1:35

1881.1.2006 13:40

Im in shock. I just came back from vacation and this hit me in the face like a ton of bricks. Does this mean the software itself is no longer avaiable too? If you have it downloaded will it still work? I have a lot of questions is there a forum section for questions related to this? So Sad :(

1891.1.2006 17:07

To date, the US Congress has maintained their view that proposed legal restrictions to sensor content on the Internet is totally off limits. We all tolerate certain subject matter on the Internet, like Porn and Hate Speech, because a worldwide medium that allows the free exchange of ideas and services is far more important than any one commercial enterprise. When you consider legal actions like this one that are proliferating throughout the various governments of Europe, it's only a matter of time until multi-national corporate power and big money wins out in the US and we all suffer from the onslaught of global fascism hiding behind a smoke screen of free trade and open markets. Let the revolution begin!

1901.1.2006 18:27

it is really starting to get annoying hearing the same thing over and over in this thread. "every one, make sure you've dl'ed the software, does this mean the software is gone forever". Here is the topic from the #ad_buddies chatroom.

(13:45:12) topic: (' help channel. Please wait patiently for assistance. NO !list, NO @find -- check out while you wait. :' Guides can be found here & Software here
The software and guides are right there for the taking. now please stop whinging.

1911.1.2006 18:30

ok laws are like honest... They are for honest people... Regardless of the laws passed, you will always find software to use, if your that worried stock pile like me..........hehehhehehe

1921.1.2006 21:51

well fuck this... bye afterdawn... thanks for the memories R.I.P. afterdawn dear friend, I was with you since the beginning (tear)

1931.1.2006 22:40

bye afterdawn...

1951.1.2006 23:56

Bye my Ass! WE are what's important. If WE work together THEY can pass all the laws they want. It didn't work with alcohol or orther drugs. It didn't work with sexual material. And THIS dod don't hunt neither! Wolf

1961.1.2006 23:57

Anybody know where a guy can get a cracked spell checker? Wolf

1972.1.2006 00:20

This sucks. I and a lot of other people have put a lot of time into making AD what it is. It will be a pain to find new software links, but it will be done. This is another lame attempt to stop piracy that will inevitably fail. Why is it people who don't use this software are the ones who legislate it? Three words. Old White Men. Oh well I'll be damned if this stops me from trying to help people. Is that you're best shot Finnish Legislature? You'll have to do better than that. Long Live AD!

1982.1.2006 01:31


1992.1.2006 04:42

well im glad all of the worse things in this world are solved, so now all we have to do is get rid of illegitimate software, and then we will all be safe from bin laden.

2002.1.2006 06:21

I ain't bothered... If they want to come after all of us... Let them come... So what, if they only make 600 BILLION instead of the 750 BILLION expected targets? I'm sure the company's MD won't have to sell the private jet to hold the company's doors open! It's not fair to charge 40 for a new PS2 title! I know the game took so long to be produced by many programers, engineers etc, or that it took a zillion's worth of machinery to make it, and that it went through 1000 diferent hands before it got to my local where i bought it... Everyone down that line made money... It's my turn now... Not that i actually make money out of it, but i will save one hell of a lot, that's for sure! It's easy for them to set the price as high as that, they know it's good stuff and that most people are going to buy it regardless of what damage it will make to their lives, and they'll make 400% profit on it all the time! The way this world (Europe at least) is going, where you had once a middle class, there's nothing there... And the ones left are half executive anyway... The ones that were born above the said class have got a lot of money and don't even have to think about spending 40 quid on a toy! The ones that unfortunatelly (like me, my dad's first colour tv was bought when i was 10, i'm 27...) never had the chance to go up in life very quick and have to work looong hours every week just to get on with it, (and i don't think i'm alore here...), those have to try and find ways around to the back door... It's only fair! It's business... ;) If they want to stop piracy, they need to lower the prices on their gear! My example was a PS2 game, but it happens with EVERYTHING! Why pay the big bucks when you can get it cheaper or for free? I won't! For the simple reason that it isn't justified enough! Here in Britain, we already pay too much for everything, just think about it! 0.90+ just for a litre of petrol... Takes the piss! The cost of life here is the hairyest on earth! My point is that i see a LOT of people really surprised with this situation! You lot aren't british! You aren't used to live with lobbies... That's how it works... Every day there's a new law coming out restricting our movements more and more. I love Britain but i have to say that i have been in plces in europe where you can say: I'm free to do whatever i want! This ain't one of those! Don't take too much care it's just a thought...

If it ain't broken it doesn't need fixing...
Newbies, look for it here first:
The Holy List:

2012.1.2006 09:37

As you can see finnish Parliament sucks becose they make this stupid laws. Little time ago they made a law that you cannot but music on your mp3 player but still i can see those players in shop. What a f*ck you gonna do whit the player if you cannot but music on it?

2022.1.2006 12:10

And It's hard enough to find Mac software to backup DVD's etc ! Why don't all the politicians admit that they have shares in the media companies and so the laws will help their little profit shares at the end of the year. All the guides and links were great. Such a shame that 100 or so dimwits who can't even use a VHS are in charge!! I'll stay here and watch. Good luck and watch out for blue (or green lights) Blackie...

2032.1.2006 17:24

Its interesting that commercial software such as Alcohol 120% and AnyDVD are on their list, since those programs can (and are) used for legit purposes. Legit here in the US anyway. We can make personal backups of our own dvds or cds. I dont see why other countries are not doing the same thing. It doesnt make any sense. Hope the site doesnt go away for good, its been a big help to me. Jon Oregon

2042.1.2006 17:31

Its interesting that commercial software such as Alcohol 120% and AnyDVD are on their list, since those programs can (and are) used for legit purposes. Legit here in the US anyway. We can make personal backups of our own dvds or cds. I dont see why other countries are not doing the same thing. It doesnt make any sense.
I live in the state of Virginia... It is NOT legal to back up our DVDs in the US... Yes, those programs can be used for legit purposes. Backups are not one of those purposes. Its a shame though. I wish it were legal.

2052.1.2006 17:36

THERE ARE OVER 2,000,000 MUSIC CDS SOLD WITH THE SONY ROOTKIT VIRUS IN THE WILD AND THE SONY ROOTKIT WILL INSTALL ON YOUR COMPUTER IF YOU INSERT THE CD AND AGREE TO THE TERMS OR NOT AS IT WILL INSTALL THE ROOTKIT. AS OF TODAY THERE IS NO WAY TO REMOVE THE ROOTKIT VIRUS. AnyDVD tackles Sony DRM Rootkit Virus! If AnyDVD is installed and active on your PC, the new so-called "Sony DRM Rootkit Virus" has no access to your system and THROUGH the affected audio CD Another good reason to get AnyDVD!

2062.1.2006 17:44

i just wanted to say thank you.ive been a loyal after dawn addict for about two years.our communtity has suffered a lose no doubt.but to our senior members, down to our newbies thank you, you have been a termendous help to me.sometimes sarcastic but fun non the less.i hope we can continue our forums atleast we should get to keep that.thanks guys..

2072.1.2006 17:57

"I live in the state of Virginia... It is NOT legal to back up our DVDs in the US... Yes, those programs can be used for legit purposes. Backups are not one of those purposes. " Well, I see "fair use" as my ability to make personal backups of my dvds. And the DMCA stating that we cant break CSS is a direct contradiction of US Copyright Law giving us Fair Use. So the Feds can suck it.

2082.1.2006 18:04

Agreed, however... that doesn't make it legal.

2093.1.2006 01:07

Does this mean the software itself is no longer avaiable too? If you have it downloaded will it still work?
@MsLoveLee: If you own a book that can't be legally published anymore, do the pages go blank? The software will still work fine, and for the most part it's still available elsewhere on the 'net; AfterDawn just can't host it anymore.
This message has been edited since its posting. Latest edit was made on 03 Jan 2006 @ 1:09

2103.1.2006 02:57

It is really interesting that you mentioned a book. Copyright law allows you to make 1 copy for personal or educational use. Now what's why are DVD's & CD's different?

2113.1.2006 03:17

Sadly, our Progressive thinking brethren in Finland are taking a giant step towards being more like us here in the draconian USofA. Another vestige of freedom lost

2123.1.2006 03:39

Illegal or not I don't care what the hell they say, I'm still gonna backup my DVDs regardless of what anyone says! -Mike

2133.1.2006 04:30

what about creating a "personal" website with the content in question...would that be illegal since the site itself wasn't "commercial"?

2143.1.2006 08:34

I need a lawyer

2153.1.2006 09:10

I live in the state of Virginia... It is NOT legal to back up our DVDs in the US... Yes, those programs can be used for legit purposes. Backups are not one of those purposes. Its a shame though. I wish it were legal.[/qoute] Fair Use Doctrine.....something the dictatorial MPAA and RIAA have forgotten!

2163.1.2006 09:15

could change the location of the servers... to a country that isn't going to care about the content

2173.1.2006 11:07

Even a small star shines in the darkness.--Finnish proverb Wolf

2183.1.2006 12:27

Hey all, there is another website that some may know of while others do not know of, it's: This site may still help those in need of DVD/Video issues since AD will no longer be hosting guides.

2193.1.2006 15:41

Hey look on the bright side, at least DVD Decrypter still stays (even though its not updated anymore its still good) and just in case heres a reason to not take it off. its not solely for ripping dvds as it is useful for making and burning your own data. Like when i have lots of things and I'm gonna burn my things to a dvd i make an iso with Nero and burn it with DVD Decrypter (I just trust decypter more i guess).

2204.1.2006 16:19

DVD Shrink gets to stay as well? Cheers to you Afterdawn, I'm still impressed with everything over the past few years. Heck I remember coming here for help on burning certain cd image files, audio file converters, etc... back when CDRWin was the sh*t, and people used Adaptec (sp?) Easy CD creator (obviously before Roxio hee hee) I kept playing around and trying to copy PS1 games (PSX hadn't caught on yet as a term) and making VCDs...lmao those were good times! I thank everyone that took the time to write guides, especially the folks who could dummy it down enough for me to understand! Gosh, I even remember back when EVERY OTHER topic and post WASN'T about the RIAA or MPAA, or this law or that law.... then again I had AOL on 5 1/4 floppy disks, running on my Zenith ZDS, pimped out with the monochrome monitor...when 14.4 modem was pimpin' and people ran BBSs... we sure in a decline of being able to have "fun" without getting hounded by the law. Reflective rant aside, kudos to you Afterdawn for making it this far with the content you have hosted. I'm sure even with the new Finnish laws you'll still be the premiere "go-to" site for all things audio/visual. -Minnesota Guy

2214.1.2006 17:00

this law really bites. haven"t got to use it much, hope you find a way around this archaic law, pissed off pennsy

2226.1.2006 06:05

I`ve been coming to this site for a few years now and have learned more than anyone else I know locally about A/V software. This site is a great teaching guide and it`s a damn shame it has to be censored. I`m afraid it won`t be long before they remove any and all software of A/V formatt from the market and throw any blackmarket programmers into prison for life. After all, you get caught selling pot you`ll do more time than if you murder someone. A life sentence would have to be appropriate for a programmer. Toofer

2239.1.2006 01:47

Manton Its just a matter of time till the big boys buy out AnyDVD and the rights.

2249.1.2006 02:44

Free programs such as DVD43, DVDFabDecrypter etc... will probably go before AnyDVD since they obviously don't generate the cash flow that AnyDVD does And, just this past weekend, AnyDVD 'backed up' a CD (using Nero) that my daughter was unable to 'back up' using the same program without AnyDVD when a program leaves, another will certainly take it's place

DISCLAIMER: If you find a posting or message from me
offensive, inappropriate, or disruptive, please ignore it.
If you dont know how to ignore a posting, complain to
me and I will be only too happy to demonstrate . . .

22510.1.2006 17:59

I would say incorporate in another country and then set up a website in that country that will allow you to provide links to that website. Also, is it illegial to provide links to slysoft and there products?

22627.1.2006 00:52

When CocaCola dosn't want to pay tax they invent a virtual head quater in the Cayman Islands. They don't even have an office there by the way. There must be a place where you can break almost any copyright. Let me guess. China? Thailand? Russia? So on a website sited on such a location anything goes. In Sweden they have organised a new political party the Pirate Party, which aim is to legalize all software piracy.;-) It is a fundamental issue that a programme is not worn out if 1 million people downloaded it. It remains the same. It is like a never ending meal that can feed all the human race from the same plate of food. It is potential richness for all the human race. This prosperity is attacked by a handfull of greedy corporate people, that does not want to share those opportunities of wealth. It is essential that we the people demand a share in that wealth! greetings from "Lyrik"

22727.1.2006 06:21

Lyrik, you made the perfect analogy. Feed all of humanity from the same plate of food. Don't you think something that universally genius ought to be supported and rewarded to the individuals who spent tons of time, money and energy, all kinds of resouces to introduce the product years ago, evolve it through innovative evolutionary upgrades and plans to continue funding through continued product developemnt? Commuinst or capitalist I'm sure you like to reward constructive workers and continue to fund the engines of progress. Am I right?

22827.1.2006 23:59

Response to mikecUSA: I do not see it as a job for me to make a crusade for the firms to make more money. 1 % americans owns 50% of the worlds riches and they don't share! They want films and software to be expensive. I want it to be really cheap. And i want anything that is available on the internet to be legal to download without restrictions. They want prohibitions. I want freedom. greets lyrik

22928.1.2006 08:03

I am a consumer that "buys", whether it be new or previously viewed. I have spent literally thousands of dollars over the past 6 years. I recently RENTED "The Fog" because this was filmed in my local area. The reviews were not that good. There is so much darn protection on it that it would not play properly. Viewing the extra features was excrutiating....each one took over a minute to load on my Toshiba. I gave up. If this is what the future holds, I am one consumer that will stop BUYING.

23028.1.2006 09:11

Well, last year i bought a pc game called Football Manager 2005. I actually bought that game as well, i'm not just saying... When i got home and tried to install it, it would not play because i had emulators on my pc. I deleted AnyDVD, Daemon Tools AND Alcohol 120% from my HDD, turned Nero's Image Drive off... But it still didn't play. Needless to say, in the end i got fed up so i copied the game, cracked it open, then used my emulators to play it... Took me in total 20 minutes to do it... Oh, and in the end i got my money back for it! What's the point in buying a new game, if you have to crack it in order to play it?

This message has been edited since its posting. Latest edit was made on 28 Jan 2006 @ 9:11

If it ain't broken it doesn't need fixing...
Newbies, look for it here first:
The Holy List:

23129.1.2006 20:22

Everything today is about money. Who has it and who doesn't! The ones who have it rule the ones who don't. Look at cars! We have several great $5000 cars today. The only problem is that they cost $20,000! Why? Because the government was so flushed (a good word) with success when they first passed emissions laws that they went and passed tougher and tougher ones. In some places the air is dirtier than what has to come out of the exhaust pipe. Who pays? The poor guy who really can't afford it. Guys like Trump and Bill Gates don't even know (or care!) what their cars cost to buy, maintain, insure or run. Oh well, I guess when you have more money than you would ever need, $2.50 a gallon or more doesn't mean much. Sony better hope that I don't get their ROOTIP VIRUS because they are going to get sued! Not in the usual way but in a way that will cripple them in the Stock Market. What they have done is just as much a crime as some hacker breaking into Micro$oft or some other big company. They have broken the law and hacked their way into the many "injured Parties" computers. The courts cannot allow Sony to get away with it while prosecuting and imprisoning people that hack into a system and plant a virus. Not with a company the size of Sony doing the same thing!

23230.1.2006 12:18

Oh well, I guess when you have more money than you would ever need, $2.50 a gallon or more doesn't mean much
I wish i only paid that for petrol... In Britain we pay about 0.88 per litre... Do your counts and then tell me what you think about it on a normal workers wage... In the US everything is cheap compared to the prices we carry in Europe. (Britain beeing one of the most expensive)

If it ain't broken it doesn't need fixing...
Newbies, look for it here first:
The Holy List:

23330.1.2006 17:00

Instead of passing a new copyright law they should focus on catching crooks and killers. I'm not familiar with statistics in Finland so bear with me and it's just an idea.

23430.1.2006 18:09

Permiggs, That's the reason Britain stayed with 8 bit computers long after the rest of the world went to 16 bits. Back in those days and Amstrad 8 bit machine cost twice as much as a 386 did here. That and the fact that virtually all the home and business computers there at that time were 8 bit antway. I don't know what the chip was but it may have been a Z80. Seem to remember a price tag of around $5000 with a monochrome monitor. theonejrs

GigaByte 990FXA-UD5 - AMD FX-8320 @4.0GHz @1.312v - Corsair H-60 liquid CPU Cooler - 4x4 GB GSkill RipJaws DDR3/1866 Cas8, 8-9-9-24 - Corsair 400-R Case - OCZ FATAL1TY 550 watt Modular PSU - Intel 330 120GB SATA III SSD - WD Black 500GB SATA III - WD black 1 TB Sata III - WD Black 500GB SATA II - 2 Asus DRW-24B1ST DVD-Burner - Sony 420W 5.1 PL-II Suround Sound - GigaByte GTX550/1GB 970 Mhz Video - Asus VE247H 23.6" HDMI 1080p Monitor

23510.2.2006 09:54

Hi folks, Is there another Website that has the Programs remvoed from "AfterDawn" site due to the New Finnish Rule?? If so, please give me the URL. THANKS!

23611.2.2006 22:31

I made an interesting find (literally!)the other day. Seems I was walking down the street and spotted a paper DVD envelope. In it was an "official" copy of King Kong that was made for the Motion Picture Academy. Only to be viewed by the judges for consideration when voting for the Oscars. It even briefly runs a message across the bottom of the screen saying just that, while you are viewing the movie! Since it is not yet available on DVD and so far there has been no release date given for when it will be available! And since it isn't a "9" disk, I wonder what program they illegally used to make it??? Theonejrs P.S. To the MPAA. No you can't have it back. It's in the hands of the legal people. Want to do something usefull? Catch the guy who is copying and selling your DVDs! He's the one who is causing you your problems. I only want to back up my own personal DVDs, put the original away and not worry about some idiot messing up the copy by using it as a frisbie, as I can always make a replacement from my original. I call it a "working" copy I'm not talking about Piracy, I'm talking about my right to make a copy of my bought and paid for DVD for my own personal use! A little food for thought MPAA. 10 million people can't be wrong! In fact, it's a rather large group of people you pissed off! Believe me when I say "this will come back to haunt you"! Do us both a favor and go after the people who are hurting you financially. Not the 10 million or more you've wronged! You will discover that piracy is not the guy in his home making a copy for his own personal use. It's the guy who makes a copy off of the theater screen with a digital video camera or steals an "Official" copy like the one I found and runs off copies of it at $10 or $15 bucks a shot. He's the guy you need to get! The public outcry over you guys winning legislation to ban all copying of DVDs has prompted enough interest as there are now several official fact finding surveys that show that over 93% of people using encryption removal, ripping and copying software, do so for THEIR OWN PERSONAL USE! Out of the 7% left a little over 2% of that are average Jane and Joe who make a few bucks selling DVDs. That only leaves 5%. They are the 5% who are the extremely well organized, well equipped, who bang out thousands of copies of any movie you put on the screen and sell it on the street! Better yet, go get the guy that sold it to them in the first place. You know, the guy who works for the studio! He shouldn't be too hard to find. He's the one with a couple of extra grand in his bank account at the right time. When you find and stop him you will then discover that you took the wrong route and in the process you managed to piss off 10 million people! Enough Said!!! theonejrs

23714.2.2006 23:08

If some of us in this forum made a copy of all the banned software, it could be offered to us, by us, for us...and screw the FINISHIAN COPYRIGHT LAW. I still think that if I bought something, and paid for legally belongs to me! I want to unlock a copy, burn a backup and sell the original on eBay at a discount. WHAT'S WRONG WITH THAT!!! What happened to free enterprise. Abroad you can buy as much pirated software and movies as you want...imagine WINDOWS XP PRO for 3 bucks and the latest movies too. The worst part is that it gets brought into the US and people pass it thru US Customs too. The Chinese are the kings on piracy, next are the the Arab countries.

23811.4.2006 09:27

PLUG-INs: What if ... WHAT IF you make your software "open". That means, you remove what is illegal in your country and let someone, somewhere make the plug-ins, services, whatever that will add such "functionality" in your backbone software. It could not even be installed together. It could be based on web services or even SOA. Software in the future will be a collaborative "mess" so big that no one will be able to identify really who/what/where is that ? Think about ... move ahead into the future and let the all those boundaries behind. Regards.

23920.6.2006 22:18

Does Finland have what we in the US call "judicial review"? I admit to almost complete ignorance of Finnish law (ok, complete ignorance except for the language of this law). Basically, the judicial branch has the authority--in most cases--to throw out laws that violate the Constitution or what the Anglo-Saxon counties call "common law." In a nutshell, in our country, a law like this would have to pass muster in court for the very reasons cited: it's vauge to the point of being incomprehensible. There's no language in the statute which tells someone what does or does not constitute a violation. Which means that someone with no criminal intent whatsoever could quite unintentionally violate it. There is also a mechanism in US law which allows affected parties to challenge a law without "breaking" it--in other words, a "test" case is not necessary. A law can be challenged in Federal court and the Executive branch (or ministry in parliamentary systems) would have to prove to a judge that the law was in fact legal. If the judge find that it is not, the law is thrown out. Before trial, in many cases, enforcement of the law in question is suspended by the judge hearing the case. I know Finland has a constitution. Surely there's got to be a way to challenge this absurd law. I know more about Finnish history (way to go kicking the crap out of the Soviets in '40!); Finns are considered some of the best soldiers in history--perhaps even equal to ours. Certainly in the same league with the German Army of 1870-1945, the French Army of 1792-1812, the British Army of 1689-1815, or the Roman Army ( ca. 300 BCE to 200CE)

24015.8.2006 13:27

n0v0n (15 Feb 06 posting) is confused about the conditions under which we all (globally) purchased CDs and DVDs (and all other recorded material / software as well). We NEVER purchase the movie / music / software / whatever. We ONLY purchase the media upon which it resides AND the license to use the movie / music / software / whatever recorded thereon WITHIN the rules spelled out in the EULA. Sorry n0v0n. That has been true for decades; and quite frankly is as reasonable as it gets. The PROBLEM which everyone is concerned about is the corruption of the Fair Use policy by Microsoft and Hollywood so they can fatten their quarterly bottom lines (which is the only measure these folks are measured on).

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